Why The Jamaican Dancehall Song "Murder She Wrote" Is Called "Mama Shiroo" & Similar Sounding Names In Kenya, East Africa

culturaroots, Nov 2, 2007
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Total statistics as of Feb.12, 2024 at 9:14 PM
Totl # of views - 67,657,504

Total # of comments - 14,181

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Edited by Azizi Powell

Latest update- Feb. 13, 2024

This is Part II of a two part pancocojams series about Chaka Demus & Pliers' 1992 Jamaican Dancehall song "Murder She Wrote". 

This post showcases the same YouTube video of Chaka Demus & Pleirs' 1992 Jamaican Dancehall song "Murder She Wrote".that was showcased in Part I of this series.

This post also provides a definition of the linguistic term "folk processing" as an explanation for why some Kenyans and some other Africans refer to the Jamaican Dancehall song "Murder She Wrote" as "Mama Shiro" or other similar titles.

This post also presents some information about the Kenyan song entitled "Mama Ciru".

Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2024/02/chaka-demus-pliers-jamaican-dancehall.html for Part I of this pancocojams series. That post presents showcases a YouTube video of Chaka Demus & Pliers' 1992 Jamaican Dancehall song "Murder She Wrote". This post also presents a brief excerpt from this song's Wikipedia page.

That pancocojams post also provides a compilation of some comments from that video's discussion thread in which the commenters mention the name of their country or are replies to those comments. These comments were published in 2016-2024 (as of the date of the publication of this pancocojams post)*.
 
*After uploading numerous pages of comments from this video's discussion thread, my computer wouldn't upload any additional pages. It's likely that numerous comments that fit this sub-set of comments are featured in those pages that I wasn't able to upload. 

The content of this post is presented for historical, socio-cultural, entertainment, and aesthetic purposes.

These comments document that many people throughout the world have been aware of and have had an appreciation for Chaka Demus & Pliers' Dancehall song "Murder She Wrote" since that record's was first released.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to Chaka Demus & Pleirs for their musical legacy. Thanks to Sly & Robbie for creating the bam bam riddem (beat) of this song that was/is also used for some other Dancehall songs. Thanks to all those who are quoted in this post and thanks to the publishers of this video on YouTube.

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PARTIAL LYRICS FOR "MURDER SHE WROTE" (Original Mix)
(as sung by Chaka Demus & Pleirs"

I know this little girl
Her name is maxine
Her beauty is
Like a bunch of rose
If I ever tell you 'bout maxine
You would a say
I don't know what I know
(But)

Murder she wrote
(Fi real fi real)
Murder she wrote
Murder she wrote
Murder she wrote

Watch ya now, it name
A pretty face and bad character
Dem the kinda livin
Can't hold Chaka (Follow me)
A pretty face
And bad character
Dem the kinda livin'
Can't hold Chaka
Seh gal yuh pretty
Yuh face it pretty
But yuh character dirty
Gal yuh just act too flirty flirty
Yuh run to Tom, Dick
An' also Harry
An when yuh find yuh mistake
Yuh talk bout yuh sorry
Sorry, sorry (Come now)"...
-snip-
Click https://genius.com/Chaka-demus-and-pliers-murder-she-wrote-original-mix-lyrics for the complete lyrics for this song.

Pancocojams Editor's note: "Tom", "Dick", and "Harry" used to be very common nicknames for males in the English language. The phrase "Tom, Dick, and Harry" mean "any man" or "a number of men chosen at random."   

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A BRIEF EXPLANATION ABOUT THE FOLK PROCESS IN SONGS AND RHYMES
The definition of "folk processing" that I'm using in this post is "the unintentional changing of a word or words to a song because of mishearing or misremembering." Folk processing also occurs when an unfamiliar word or words is mistaken for or unintentionally replaced by a familiar word or words that sound the same or sound similarly. This replacement of unfamiliar words/words with familar words/words is done so that the song/rhyme makes sense (or makes more sense) to the  person singing, chanting, or reading it.  
-snip-
Based on my online reading, It appears that when people in some African nations, but particularly in Kenya, East Africa, sang the Jamaican Dancehall song "Murder She Wrote" it was quite common to sing the words "Mama Shiro" or similarly sounding words for the unfamiliar English words " murder she wrote". 

As noted above, folk processing may occur when people mishear a word or words and replace those words or unfamiliar word or words in a song or a rhyme with a word, words, or a sound that they are familiar with.

In the last comment that I quoted from the discussion thread of the embedded "Murder She Wrote" video (found immediately below), a commenter wrote "we use to sing [Mama Shiroo] the same in Kenya. We had girls name shiro ( short form of wanjiru) and they would be pissed off. "

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THE KENYAN SONG "MAMA CIRU" ("MAMA CHIRU") 
My curiousity about the name "Mama Shiroo" in Kenya led me to some YouTube music videos of the Kikuyu song (or songs?) entitled "Mama Ciru" or "Mama Chiru". Here's a link to one of those videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0186CyHZsnI Mama Ciru John Ndichu,  Jan 27, 2011. Some commenters in that video's discussion thread referred to that song as a classic and one commenter @michaelgichia2048 wrote in 2019 that "This song was such a hit that people in salaam clubs adopted  the name mama chiru. Same with some businesses".

In 2023 another commenter @edwingikura shared this explanation for that song: "It's about a man who says that he loved his wife very much, but after 10 years  or so she changed like a snake she even started seeing other men and on  one or two occasions he was almost attacked by the men she was with in a bar.

He then says that he's friends told him that even if he loves her more then money he has to move on."
-end of quote-
That storyline for "Mama Ciru" is quite similar to the lyrics for the Jamaican Dancehall song 'murder She Wrote", but I don't think that the tunes and tempos for those two songs are the same or even similar. 

Here's information about the song "Mama Ciru" from an article about the death of  Kenyan singer/composer Mûrîithi John Walker  https://debunk.media/muriithi-john-walker-an-obituary-in-seven-songs/ "Mûrîithi John Walker: An Obituary In Seven Songs by Ras Menge Sham Feb, 8, 2023
..."I had never heard this song before this performance. Kîrîro kîa Mama Cirû is a fun genre-bending song that invites the listener to let go and let loose. Come, let’s play. Let’s do it as we listen to Mama Cirû’s lamentations, is the song’s request. The question I had earlier comes back and presents itself differently: Does it matter to Mugithi musicians what the song they are singing is about?

Kîrîro kîa Mama Cirû samples Murder She Wrote by Chaka Demus and Pliers. When we were children we misheard ‘Murder She Wrote’ as ‘Mama Ciru’. I think this is what Mûrîithi John Walker wants to do with the song, to take us back to that place of invention, that place, like that of childhood, where a world can be created. The song, as different as it sounds with its punchy riffs and rolling bass guitar, still sounds like Mugithi, and still looks like the man on stage. There is the serious foundational Kikuyu pop sound, brown, loose, and ever present like his suit. And then there is the experimental stuff, the turtleneck and the silver chain that says I’m here to play, to mess around and find out."
-snip-  
Please share any memories or information that you have about this Kenyan song entitled "Mama Ciru" in the comment section below. Thanks!

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SELECTED COMMENTS ABOUT THE USE OF THE WORDS "MAMA SHIRO" INSTEAD OF "MURDER SHE WROTE" IN THAT JAMAICAN DANCEHALL SONG

From https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-av7F1JBmj4 [This is the video that is embedded above]

These are only some of the comments in that discussion thread that refer to singing "Mama Shiro" instead of "Murder She Wrote". 

2020

1.@kmuturi238
"Kenyans who grew up singing "Murder Shiro" and "Mama Shiro" let's gather here😂😂😂🇰🇪🇰🇪🇰🇪💙
-snip-
This comment had 1.6 likes and 110 replies (as of Feb. 11, 2024 at 10:02 PM EDT)

Unless otherwise noted, the non-English words given below are in Swahili. Their Swahili meaning is given below the comment (from Google translate from Swahili to English.) Additions and corrections are welcome.

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2. @alexwambua4492
"Mama Shiro😂"

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3. @kmuturi238
"😂😂Mimi nilikuwa nasikia "murder Shiro"
-snip-
"I was hearing "murder Shiro"

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4. hiroo... Mama shiroooo

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5. @alexsirzlopez3204
"Tuko ndani mama shiro tuko ndani"
-snip-
"We are in, mother shiro, we are in"

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6. @flostar3790
"😋😋"

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7. @jamesmtaita6120
"Anaitwa Chuck Odemus ni mjaluo wa Jamaica.."
-snip-
"His name is Chuck Odemus, he is from Jamaica"

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8. @ThatguyJoshman
"Tuko hapa nyuma ya tent😂"
-snip-
"We are here behind the tent😂"

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9. @petesnow2484
"I'm nigerian..... but lol. that was funny"

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10. @adilmohamed1784
"but I'm not the only one who grew up with this mother shiro umwakinHahaha mother shiro we thought it was a mother from kiambu"
-snip-
"Kiambu" is a town in Kenya, East Africa.

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11. @soniemaina
"Guilty as charged 😂😂😂😂"

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12. @everydayapps7225
"Wakenya hamkosangi kila mahali.🔥 Wooho 🔥
-snip-
"Kenyans are everywhere"

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13. @nukonuko1184
"We never knew she wrote 😂😂😂"

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14. @rusticpoet
"hahahahaha! I remember everyone going wild when that part came on! Murder shiro, murder shiro!

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15. @nickie2483
"😭😭😭😭😭"

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16. @aajabbinmagosh5509
"Madam shiro"

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17.@muufenty774
"Tuko wengi😅😅"
-snip-
"We are many".

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18. @gracesherry2964
"😂😂😂😂😂here i am"

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19. @kenyanswiss
"Matha shiro"

 
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20. @imaniimani3709
"🤣😅🤣😅🤣😅 lol wacha tu but  it flowed though"
-snip-
"wacha tu" = "just let it go"

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21. @alyfepoisonbunny2716
"I grew up with this song 🇹🇹🇹🇹🇹🇹🇹🇹"
-snip-
"TT"= Trinidad and Tobago (a Caribbean nation)

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22. @lucielucie9646
"I still do. Sounds better that way 😂😂😂"

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23. @TheEdnablue
"Tupo hapa 🤣"
-snip-
"We are here"

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24. @kendrickswife
"Straight uppppp!!!!!!!😂😂"

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25.@shiikamau403
"we r in which.tent😂😂"

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26.@bobkipkoech
"😂😂😂Great seeing my fellow Kenyans hapa"
-snip-
"hapa" = "here"

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27. @chaavinabbey9546
"Bruh, er'body sang it like that... 💥🔥 We Go"

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28.@carolinewambui9506
"Bado ni mama shiro😂😂
-snip-
"It still is mama shiro"

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27. @brian_mwangi
"mada shiro :-)"

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28. @adimwangi758
"Mother Shiro''

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29.@rebeccawambui7510
"Yeeey aki ukweli."
-snip-
"Yes, it's true".

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30. @bernardwanjohi7201
"🤣🤣🤣💀💀💀"

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31.@chrispinuswafula3029
"Hahahaha mother Shiroooo"

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32. @danniarscott3233
"That’s hilarious 😂"

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33.@lorrdolly
"And it remains murder shiro forever...... Takes me back to F2 jam sessions in the afternoon"

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34.@rossitahwayua9171
"Hata Leo ni mada shiroooo..lol"
-snip-
"Even today it is mada shirooo lol"

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35. @mosebrownie4013
"I think Jamaican song rock in kenya than Jamaica yenyewe😁 mother shiroo
=snip-
"Yenyewe" = itself
-snip-
My interpretation of that comment (as an African American who doesn't speak Swahili) is "I think the Kenyan version with the words "Mother Shiroo" rocks (is better) than the Jamaican song with the words "Murder she wrote".
..
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36. @nancywanjiru820
"Hehehehhe gosh tumetoka mbali, I rem my uncle told me it's murder shiro"
-snip-
"tumetoka mbali" = we have come a long way.

"rem" = a non-standard short form of the English word "remember".

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37.@kendykellis8715
"Mother Shiro waaaah"
-snip-
"waaaah" a sound like you're laughing so hard you are crying.

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38.@felixkhale
"Nigerians too.😭😭😂😂"

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39.@ndimoowawangari9875
"Mother cirû"

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40. @mitcheallchikowore2447
"😂😂😂😂😂😂😂 I'm not from Kenya  also I used to sing
medha Shiroo 🇿🇼🇿🇼
-snip-
"Zw" =Zimbabwe

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41.@benabena1908
"The first reggae song that I knew."

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42. @drakeweru9505
"The accuracy 🤣🤣"

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43. @abietrue404
"lol"

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44. @husseinjuma3126
"Mayo shiro🤣🤣🤣"

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45.@loisemuhia8130
"Present"

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46. @shanzie593
"Lmao"

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47. @candicetshuma5954
"Even Zimbabweans 😂😂😂"

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48. @LoftusBlake
"pete snow  Nigerians understand Jamaican Patios right?"

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49. @faithwahomedon3158
"Alex Wambua  we umeharibu 😂😂"
-snip-
"we umeharibu" = "you have ruined it "

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2021

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50.@asiyyahmullen8777
"Merdashiro 🤣"

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51. @essiechege3710
"Manda shiro"

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52. @aminamakokha2761
"Leo ushamba umetoka after 40 yrs 😂😂😂😂nitaambia nini watu"
-snip-
"Today the farm has come out after 40 yrs 😂😂😂😂 what am I going to tell people"
-snip-
I'm not sure what this comment means, but I think the commenter is asking how does he tell people in his village that what they think this song means isn't what it really means.

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53. @lucyreigns836
"😂😂😂😂😂😂 cheza chini  murder shiro"
"cheza chini"= "play down"

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54. @fatimaabdallah2408
"Murder shiro milele 😂"
-snip-
"Murder shiro forever"

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55.@TanDaGodDiva
"Hello muderrrrr shhhhhiiiroooo"

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56. @TanDaGodDiva
"Muderrrrr Shiiiroooo!!!!"

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57.@saradubai6974
"Yeah I grew up knowing it was "mother shiro" I didn't know it was,
"murder she wrote" 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂so funny n fool of me!"

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58.@lizk2643
"my little sis.. still call her murder shiro"

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59.@motherofanangel1143
"Lmaooooo"

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60.@Radiocity256
"ndio mama shiroo"
-snip-
"yes, mama shiroo"

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61.@reecemwongeli2698
"🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣kumbe si mimi pekee nilikua na hii umbwakin ya mother shiro"
-snip-
"but I'm not the only one who grew up with this mother shiro umwakin"

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62. @kylielinae
"It's still "mother Shiro" and "no woman no cry" not "no woman don't cry" Wakenya tuko everywhere"
-snip-
"Wakenya tuko everywhere" = "We are Kenyans everywhere."

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63. @manni2723
"Mother Shiro"

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64.@avrilhernandez4635
"Not Kenyan, but Caribbean 🇩🇴 and I grew singing the same thing 🤣"

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65.@Just_Tracy
"yesss nilifanya kitu kimoja i use to say "muder shiro"

-snip-
"yesss I did the same thing i use to say "muder shiro"

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66.@yumnathomas6591
"😭😭😭#epic!!!!😂😂😂🖤❤"

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67.@katusiimeevelyne5445, 2020
"Here in Uganda we still play this song in bars as though it was released yesterday 🤗😂😂"

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68. @Ankunda717, 2020
"Its an everyday song hahaha"

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69.@Youngxfatal93, 2020
"All day everyydayy 💯"

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70. @orikirizacharliebrown3912, 2020
"Me I could sing it like, mother shiro🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 shame di me"

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71. @WallySheccid, 2020
"Du yu nou de way mai brudah?"
-snip-
My guess is that this question "Do you know the way my brother?" means "Do you know the correct words for this song, my brother?"

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72, @orikirizacharliebrown3912, 2020

"Wally Mendoza  na  tell me"

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73. @sarahkukiriza6174, 2021
"@Orikiriza Charlie Brown  ur not alone..me I shouted imara shiro  in 90s until when 
  I got the lyrics in a newspaper. I nearly fainted laughing."

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74. @orikirizacharliebrown3912, 2021
"Sarah Kukiriza  omg 🤔🤔😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

😂😂😂😂😂😂"

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75.  @sarahkukiriza6174, 2021
"Orikiriza Charlie Brown  I even told  the story to my kids .even if u rewind it 10 tyms
u would still hear the same lyrics and fits right.  Ooh those days are good to remember"

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76. @orikirizacharliebrown3912,2021

"Sarah Kukiriza  your just funny🤣🤣🤣🤣"

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@sheriekasirye1321, 2021
"I remember in 90's our yrs this song would be played many times but no one would be
able to sing the real lyrics.

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@ivelocairfa9872, 2021
" Orikiriza Charlie Brown  🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🥰, we use to sing the same in Kenya. 
We had girls name shiro ( short form of wanjiru) and they would be pissed off. I remember those sweet days walai."

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This concludes Part II of this two part pancocojams series.

Thanks for visiting pancocojams.

Visitor comments are welcome. 

  

"Hey Mr. Willy" And Other Folk Processed Forms Of "Frog Missed The Lily Pad" In "Down ByThe Banks Of The Hanky Panky Rhymes (with geographical locations)

Edited by Azizi Powell

Latest revision - December 10, 2023

This pancocojams post presents the sources for the words "Frog missed the lily pad and went kerplop" words in "Down By The Banks Of The Hanky Panky" children's recreational rhymes.

This post also defines what I mean by "folk processing" as it pertains these rhymes and  presents some examples of "Down By The Banks Of The Hanky Panky" that include folk processed forms of those words. These featured rhyme examples in this post are given with their  geographical locations (as noted by their contributors).  

A lot of other versions of "Down By The Banks Of The Hanky Panky" can be found online without their contributors noting their geographic locations.

The content of this post is presented for folkloric purposes.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to all those who contributed examples to this compilation.
-snip-
This is part of an ongoing pancocojams series on the recreational rhyme "Down By The Banks Of The Hanky Panky". There are LOTS of pancocojams posts about this rhyme.  
 
Some examples that are included in this post may also be found in previous pancocojams posts on this rhyme including https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2021/03/part-i-of-some-examples-of-down-by_22.html  "Part I of Some Examples Of "Down By The Banks Of The Hanky Panky" Rhymes With Geographic Locations (A - J)" 

and

https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2021/03/part-ii-of-some-down-by-banks-of-hanky.html "Part II of Some "Down By The Banks Of The Hanky Panky" Rhymes" With Geographic Locations (K - Z)" .

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THE 1955 SOURCE FOR THESE WORDS
Folk singer Pete Seeger's 1955 "Foolish Frog" book and song is the direct source of "Froggy missed the lily pad and went kerplop" and their folk processed versions in "Down By The Banks Of The Hanky Panky" rhymes. 

Here's that portion of that book/song:
"There was a big old bullfrog, hopping from bank to bank. (Sound effects). Well, the bullfrog looked up and saw the farmer and decided to show off. He took an extra special big hop - z-z-z-z-tt! He landed, splash! in the water and got himself all wet."

Click https://genius.com/Pete-seeger-the-foolish-frog-lyrics for the complete lyrics for Pete Seeger's "Foolish Frog"

Click https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NksJ32bjFd4 for a sound file of Pete Seeger's "Foolish Frog".

Pete Seeger's "Foolish Frog" book and song is built on earlier songs, particularly the 1830s or 1840s poem "Minstrels Of The Pasquotank" by James Biddle Shepherd and the composition that is known as "May Irwin's Frog Song" that was written in 1896 by Charles E. Trevathan and recorded in 1907 by vaudeville singer May Irwin.

Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2023/11/how-certain-song-sources-other-real.html for sources for Pete Seeger's "Foolish Frog". 

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AN EXAMPLE OF THOSE WORDS IN A "STANDARD" EXAMPLE OF 'DOWN BY THE BANKS OF THE HANKY PANKY"

https://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=63097 Folklore: Do kids still do clapping rhymes?
GUEST,ADalton, 04 Oct 14 

"I was in elementary school when this thread started. I remember:

Down by the banks of the Hanky-Panky
Where the bullfrogs jump from bank to banky
Where the eeps, ops, soda-pops,
Froggy missed a lilly and he went ker-plop."...
-snip-
This comment also included portions of two other independently chanted rhymes.

In a subsequent comment A Dalton wrote "Forgot to add that I went to school in Los Angeles, CA. "

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WHAT I MEAN BY "FOLK PROCESSED" WORDS IN RELATION TO CHILDREN'S RECREATIONAL RHYMES 
I use the term "folk processing" In relation to children's recreational rhymes to refer to
1. the unintentional changing of a word or words in a rhyme because of mishearing or misremembering.

2. knowingly (on purpose) replacing an unfamiliar word or words with a more familiar word or words so that what is being said makes sense (or makes more sense) to that person

3. knowingly (on purpose) changing a word or words (or leaving out words) that is (are) considered to be socially unacceptable or socially problematic (such as profanity)

4. knowingly (on purpose) replacing a word or words with an updated (more contemporary) word or words, such as changing an old slang word with a currently used slang word that  basically means the same thing or changing the name of an old dance with the name of a currently popular dance

5. knowingly (on purpose) replacing a word or words with a topical referent or references (such as replacing the name of a city or state with the name of your city or state)  

****
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folk_process provides this definition of "folk processing" that is much mor scholarly than the one that I've given above:
"In the study of folklore, the folk process is the way folk material, especially stories, music, and other art, is transformed and re-adapted in the process of its transmission from person to person and from generation to generation. The folk process defines a community—the "folk community"—in and through which folklore is transmitted. While there is a place for professional and trained performers in a folk community, it is the act of refinement and creative change by community members within the folk tradition that defines the folk process.[1]"

****
Here's an excerpt from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folk_music about changing the words of a song (btw, in this context "songs" also include "rhymes") that I quoted in a 2007 Mudcat discussion thread about "Down By The Banks Of The Hanky Panky":
"Music transmitted by word of mouth through a community will, in time, develop many variants, because this kind of transmission cannot produce word-for-word and note-for-note accuracy. Indeed, many traditional folk singers are quite creative and deliberately modify the material they learn[citation needed].

Because variants proliferate naturally, it is naïve to believe that there is such a thing as the single "authentic" version of a ballad such as "Barbara Allen (song)." Field researchers in folk song (see below) have encountered countless versions of this ballad throughout the English-speaking world, and these versions often differ greatly from each other. None can reliably claim to be the original, and it is quite possible that whatever the "original" was, it ceased to be sung centuries ago. Any version can lay an equal claim to authenticity, so long as it is truly from a traditional folksinging community and not the work of an outside editor."

****
Here's one definition from http://www.folklib.net/folkfile/f.shtml  (a dictionary of folk music terms)  that I quoted in that same 2007 comment:
"folk process (see also oral tradition) the method of learning a song, forgetting some of it, adding bits of your own, and then teaching the song to someone else, complete with changes. This happens all the time, with the expected result that there are often no definitive versions of songs."

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SOME FOLK PROCESSED EXAMPLES OF THESE TYPES OF "HANKY PANKY' RHYMES

These examples are only a small number of  this type folk processed versions of "Down By The Banks Of The Hanky Panky" of "Frog Missed The Lily Pad" that I've come across.

These examples are given in no particular order.

The online sources (or other sources) and date and place citations are given without their time stamps. I added italics to highlight the folk processed form of  "Froggy missed the lily pad and went kerplop" words.

This is only one type of "Hanky Panky" rhymes that include folk processed words. One other group of folk processed "Hanky Panky" rhymes are those that include the name "Billie Jean" or a folk processed form of that name.  Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2014/04/forms-of-name-billie-jean-in-down-by.html for a 2014 pancocojams post entitled "Forms Of The Name "Billie Jean" In "Down By The Banks Of The Hanky Panky" Rhymes"

Here's the examples of rhymes that are featured in this post: 

https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2021/03/part-ii-of-some-down-by-banks-of-hanky.html [comments]

Version #1
Anonymous, February 2, 2023 

"From Utah 80's/90's:

Down by the banks of the Hanky Panky
Where the bullfrog jumps from bank to banky
Singing ee ee ii ii oh oh oo oo
Oops slap a dilly and a bar roo"

**
Version #2
Anonymous, November 8, 2023 

..."I’m from the Lacey/Toms River area of Central Jersey/Jersey Shore and this was the variety we sang at the Toms River YMCA summer camp between 2003-2007 (when I was 7-11). A lot of kids learned it there similar to this, but we had variations there too:

“Down by the banks of the hanky panky
Where the bullfrogs jump from bank to bank
Saying eep, pop, eep, pop pop
Skiddle diddle kernel pop!
I pledge allegiance to the flag
Michael Jackson makes me gag
Coca Cola messed me up
Now I’m drinking 7-Up
7-Up has no caffeine
Now I’m drinking gasoline
Gasoline ran out of fuel (or: gave me the flu) (or: isn’t good for you)
Now I’m drinking Mountain Dew
Mountain Dew fell off the mountain
Now I’m drinking from a fountain
The fountain broken
So now I’m drinking plain old coke”

Sometimes we had a verse in there like:
“7-Up has no caffeine
Now we’re talking jelly beans
Jelly beans are out of style
Now we’ve been talking for a while”

And a verse with Sprite also that I forget.
Also we had little add-ons like counting down and stuff, with clapping I think? “10, 9, 8, 7"
-snip-
This contributor also shared some other rhymes in that comment. 

**
Version #3

Amia, November 24, 2023 
"hello, i'm from utah and wanted to share the variation i learned in girl scouts ! unfortunately i don't know the actual lyrics to the last half of the song, only what it sounds like it was saying, and i haven't been able to find anyone else posting a variation like this online.

"down by the banks of the hanky panky, where the bullfrogs jump from bank to banky, saying ee ee ah ah oh oh oo" is the part i know for sure, then after that it's something like "boom slap-a-dilly with a ba-roo on you" but i dont actually know what it says, that's just what it sounds like."

**
Version #4
Anonymous, November 28, 2023
"Grew up in Northern Illinois, the state-line area between Wisconsin and Illinois. We always did the following:

“Down by the banks of the Hanky Panky, where the bullfrogs jump from bank to banky, singing eeps, ipes, Opes, Ohps, me sock-a-dilly and a ding dang dong!”

**
Version #5
Anonymous, November 28, 2023
"This is the version that I remember playing in Denver, Colorado from the 2010s:

Down by the banks of the hanky banky
Where the bullfrogs jump from bank to banky
With a heaps hops, over the tops
And lands on a lilly pad with a kerplops

I pledge allegiance to the flag
that Justin Bieber makes me gag
Coca-Cola has caffeine
and now we're talking Billie Jeans
Billie Jeans went out of style
Now lets sit and talk a while

There's a party round the corner
wont you please, please come
Bring your own cappuccino
and your own chewing gum
What is your boyfriends name
(The person who it landed on would say someone's name)
__ loves __ yadda yadda yadda
__ loves __ yadda yadda yadda
O-U-T spells you are out!

Sometimes we would just do the first part, or just the last part, depending on who we were playing with."

**
http://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2015/02/down-by-banks-of-hanky-panky-video.html [comments] 

Version #6
Anonymous, June 3, 2023 

"I learned the version I know as a kid in the early 2000's I think I was in 4th grade so that will be around 2003-2004 in Northwest Louisiana. The version we sang was quite a bit shorter and we would sit in a circle and do a hand slapping game until one person was left.
The lyrics went

Down by the riverfront hanky panky where the bullfrogs say your booties stanky and a hip hop lollipop AEIOU bamboo on YOU."   

****
https://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=94034&messages=454&page=1  Origins: Down by the Banks of the Hanky Panky [Page 1 of a 10 page discussion thread. I started this Mudcat discussion thread in 2006. . Although it is given as page 1, on pancocojams I use it as a citation for all of the pages of that Mudcat discussion thread. For some reason, this discussion thread has another link which appears to be only a portion of these rhymes. That link may also be used for Mudcat "Origins" etc. ] 

Version #7
GUEST, 07 Apr 09

"The version that I learned as a child (Arizona in the 1980s) were:

Down by banks of the hanky panky
where the bullfrog jumps from bank to banky
With a hip, hip, hip, hop
He jumps from a lilypad --
KERPLOP

 

This was sung, so it was likely taught to us by adults at summer camp.

My friends and I also had variants of the other rhymes, but they were separate"

**
Version #8
GUEST, 08 Jul 08
"when i was growing up in northern california, the lyrics i learned went, "Down by the banks of the hanky panky

Where the bullf
Fogs jump from bank to banky
With an eeps ipes opes opps
Hey Mr. Bullfrog goes kerplop!"

**
Version #9
GUEST,Amanda, 13 Oct 09
 "Beverly Hills, CA, 1984-1988. What I remember:

 Down by the banks of the hanky pank
where the bullfrogs jump from bank to bank
with an eeps, eips, opse, opps
me socka dilly with a kerplop

For the record, I was always confused by the socka dilly line, but that's what everyone sang so there you go. Seeing some of the lily pad versions is very interesting and I love all the variations!"....

**
Version #10
GUEST, David Taylor, 05 Jul 08 
"I remember when i was in 6th grade Crowley Elementary ( Visalia, Ca year 1991 ) and we sung it like this:

down by the river of the hanky pank
where the bull frog jumped from bank to bank
going eep opp soda pop
Hey Mr Willy...and he went ker-plop

 

and if you were smacked on the sound plop...you were out..and the circle got smaller...man...RECESS was fun!!!!

remember double dutch!!!" 

**
Version #11
GUEST,Emily - GA, 30 Dec 07
"I'm from GA, and my most vivid memory of playing this hand game was at girlscout camp in north ga. It was probably sometime around 1993-1995.

Our version was:

Down by the banks of the hanky panky
where the bullfrogs jump from bank to bank
you go eeps iips opes oops
chilly willy ding dong!

 

It fascinates me the number of variations on this there are. I had no idea! I sure do hope children still play these games - I have such fond memories"

**
Version #12
GUEST, Max, 15 Dec 19
"I heard this one in elementary school in Atlanta, GA, probably between '05-'08. Some variations on here got close to mine, but not quite. Here's the version I remember best:

Down by the banks of the Hanky Pank
Where the bullfrogs jump from bank to bank
Singin' eeps, ipes, opes, ups
Chilly willy ding dong
I pledge allegiance to the flag
Michael Jackson makes me gag
Coca Cola, burn it up
Now we're talkin' 7-Up
7-Up has no caffeine
Now we're talkin' Billie Jean
Billie Jean is out of sight
Now we're talkin' dynamite
Dynamite blew up the school
Now we're talkin' really cool
10, 9, 8, 7, 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1!"

**
Version #13
GUEST, 28 Nov 10
"Here's mine from either Indiana or Virginia in the mid 90's, mainly sung by girls, but boys also. we sat in a circle, with our hands interlocking, whoever it landed on was out, and so forth like many others above.

Down by the banks of the hnaky panky
where the bullfrog jump from bank to banky
with an eips aeips, opps oops,
oomph flop a dilly and an om flop flop.

**
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZDI_VchOmo "Down by the Banks of the Hanky Panky"

Version #14
@morgan_heyyy, 2022
"theres so many different versions

i learned:

down by the banks of the hanky panky where the bullfrog jumps from banks to banks saying eeps ops sodapops froggy missed a lilypad and when kerplops"

**
https://www.reddit.com/r/nostalgia/comments/pme8mi/down_by_the_banks_of_the_hanky_panky/


Version #15
Armedwithlysol, 2021
"In the Chicago suburbs:

Down by the banks of the hanky panky, where the bullfrogs jump from bank to bank, with an eeps, an opps, an oo-sock-a-dilly and a kerrr-plop!"

**
Version #16
StillHereInSomewhere, 2021
"Columbus OH Down by the banks of the hanky panky. Where the bull frogs jump from bank to banky. With an eep ipe ope oop. Oowop ditty and a bottle of rum."

**
Version #17
Former_Ad_329, 2023
"Mine was down by the bank of the Hanley Panky, where the bull frogs jump from bank to banky, saying eeps ieps ohps awps, one fell down and went ker-plop"

**
Version #18
winehoe, 2023
"This is super old but popped up when I googled the song. Central coast of California, born in the 80s: down by the banks of the hanky panky where the bull frog jumps from bank to banky. With an eeps, ops, tiddilly dops. Foggy missed the lily pad and went ker plops!"

**
Version #19
Defiant_Care_7438, 2023
Hey i lived in arizona and then kansas! the version i learned was

"down by the banks of Hanky Pankys where the bullfrogs jump from bank to bank with the ee ii oo uhhp- each little billy was a (rest) ker-plop"

**
Version #20
lanky_leo34, 2023
"From the Midwest Down by banks of the hanky panky where the bullfrogs jump from bank to banky with an eeps ipes opes umps each slapadilly with a big kerplup 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10"

**
Version #21
Emelinerandall, 2023
"I’m from the chicago subarbs and mine went: Down by the banks of the hanky panky, where the bullfrogs jump from bank to bank, with an eeps, opps, an oo-sock-a-dilly and a kerr-plops. 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8, micky mouse, built a house, donald duck, messed it up, who will pay the consequences, mouse or duck? (whoever it lands on is out)"

**
Version #22
Flimsy_Ad_8032, 2023
"Indiana :

Down by the banks of the Hankey Pankey, where the bull frog jumped from bank to bankey with an eeps, ipes, opes, oops, oop flop a dilly and an oop flop flop. Pepsi, cola, ginger ale, ginger ale, ginger ale, ginger ale, ginger ale, pepsi, cola, ginger ale, 7 up, 7up, 7up, you're out."

**
Version #23
fangirl5301, 2023
"In the Houston suburbs, it was down by the banks of the hanky-panky, where the bullfrogs jump from bank to bank saying eeps, ieps, opps, oops, chili Willy dingdong your breath smells like King Kong Coca-Cola fills you up now you’re drinking 7-Up 7-Up has no caffeine now you’re drinking gasoline gasoline was made for cars now you’re eating candy bars, candy bars was madefrom fat now now you’re eating just like that"

**
Version #24
novantinuum, 2023
"I’m so glad I found this post- I was trying desperately to remember the general lyrics of this jingle. After reading a few variations, I finally recalled the (Oregon) version I remember-

Down by the banks of the hankity pank, where the bullfrogs jump from bank to bank- With an eeps, ieps, oops, opps- there goes the lily with a big kerplop"

**
Version #25
dftbaRachel, 2023
"wow there are so many versions! i learned this from arizona friends in the 2010s, never heard it where im from in kansas.

down by the banks of Hanky Panky where the bullfrogs jump from bank to banky with the eeps, ipes, opes, ops, and a wee flipperfilly and a keerplop!”

****
https://kcls.org/content/down-by-the-banks-of-the-hanky-panky/ "Down By The Banks Of The Hanky Panky", published by KCLS, August 26, 2009 [King County Library System Headquartered in Issaquah, Washington]

Version #26

[Pancocojams Editor: This page includes a YouTube video that was made by an adult associated with KCLS] 

"Many different versions abound and can be found online!

Down by the banks of the Hanky Panky,
Where the bull frogs jump from bank to banky,
With a hip, hop, hippity, hop,
Leap off a lily pad and go KERPLOP!
Down by the banks of the Hanky Panky,
Where the bull frogs jump from bank to banky,
With a flip, flop, flippity, flop,
Leap off a lily pad and go KERPLOP!
Down by the banks of the hanky panky
Where the bullfrogs jump from bank to banky
With an eep, ipe, ope, op,
Ee-sock-a-diddly and go KERPLOP!"
-snip-
The woman who shared this rhyme described it as a jumping rhyme (meaning a rhyme that is chanted while jumping rope.j

****
https://www.mamalisa.com/?t=es&p=1769

Version #27

"Katie Nance wrote 

 "In a fit of nostalgia tonight this song came back to me. Here's how I learned it in 2004 in Southern California:

 (Two people link hands, then to the rhythm of the song pull their arms back and forth between them.)

 Down by the banks of the hanky panky
Where the bullfrogs jump from bank to banky
And a hips, hops, soda pops
Jumped on the lily and went kerplop.

 

(Now it's just chanting)

I pledge allegiance to the flag
Michael Jackson makes me gag
Coca Cola has caffeine
Now we're talking jelly beans
Jelly beans are out of style
Now we're taking for a while
Charlie Brown is it (whoever the hands were closest to was "it")."

****
https://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=94034&page=2

Version #28
GUEST,Karen, 24 May 07
"Wow, all of these different versions, and yet, the one I learned as a kid is still slightly different. Very cool. I really like the "frog missed the banky" version.

Here's mine... it starts out the same, but the vowel sounds at the end are different. I learned mine in Utah somewhere between 1986 and 1988.

Down by the banks of the hanky panky

Where the bullfrogs jump from bank to banky

With an EE EE I, I, OH, OH, OOH, OOH,

Ump slop-a-dilly and a BAROOM!

****
https://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=94034&page=3

Version #29
GUEST, Lily from the Midwest, 18 Jan 08

As for how the final winner was tallied-- when I was in elementary school (currently am 22), the final two would hold onto one another's forearms and stand over some line or crack in the ground. They'd move their arms back and forth until the final word at which point it would become a tug-of-war. Whoever stepped over the crack or line lost.

 

The version I remember best is:

 Down by the banks (and/where) the hanky-panky

And the bullfrogs jump from bank to banky

With an eeps ops soda-pop

Land on a lily and go ker-plop.

 

 But I do know there was a longer version. It just became unpopular after the first couple days. The bits above about Coca-Cola and 7-Up sound familiar, but not the parts about Michael Jackson.

****

https://www.reddit.com/r/nostalgia/comments/pme8mi/down_by_the_banks_of_the_hanky_panky/

Version #30
dftbaRachel, 2023
"wow there are so many versions! i learned this from arizona friends in the 2010s, never heard it where im from in kansas.

down by the banks of Hanky Panky where the bullfrogs jump from bank to banky with the eeps, ipes, opes, ops, and a wee flipperfilly and a keerplop!”

****
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOlfkjl55rA

Version #31
@thejaroszfamily2855, 2023
"This is amazing! It is interesting how people have so many versions of this song, I always have known it as “down by the banks of the hanky-panky where the bullfrogs jump from bank to panky with a epp ipe ope op dear Mr. Willy went kerplop.”

 ****

Thanks for visiting pancocojams.

Visitors comments are welcome.

What "Whipper Whopper" Means In "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" ("Roaches & Bedbugs") Songs/Rhymes

Edited by Azizi Powell This is Part I of a pancocojams series on the "Eenie Meenie Miney Moe" sub-set of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" ("Roaches & Bedbugs") songs. That sub-set includes the words "Eenie meenie miney moe/catch a whipper whopper by his toes" (or similarly spelled words). This post presents the results of my online research about that sub-set of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning"(Roaches & Bedbugs") songs/rhymes. Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2023/08/examples-of-whipper-whopper-forms-of-i.html for Part II of this pancocojams series. That post presents examples of a sub-set of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" ("Roaches & Bedbugs") songs/rhymes that include the words "Eenie Meenie miney moe/catch a whipper whopper by his toes" (or similarly spelled words). The content of this post is presented for folkloric, socio-cultural, recreational, and linguistic purposes. All copyrights belongs with their owners. Thanks to all those who are quoted in this post. -snip-
Click http://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2021/05/versions-of-eenie-meenie-miney-mo.html for the 2021 pancocojams post entitled "Examples Of "Eenie Meenie Miney Mo" Counting Out Rhymes In The United States".
Also, click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2023/08/i-woke-up-sunday-morning-roaches-and.html for the 2023 pancocojams post entitled "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" ("Roaches and Bedbugs") Rhymes With Demographic Information".
**** PANCOCOJAMS EDITOR'S NOTE Although the pancocojams blog focuses on Black cultures in the United States and elsewhere around the world, all of the examples of children's rhymes, songs, and cheers may not have originated with Black people. I focus on children's recreational rhymes, songs, and cheers because I enjoy those compositions and I want to document, share, and study those compositions. **** MY FINDINGS, CONCLUSIONS, AND SPECULATIONS ABOUT THESE SONGS
Here are my findings and conclusions about these songs:

1. "I Woke Of Sunday Morning" ("Roaches & Bed Bugs") songs/rhymes/songs are a relatively large family of folk compositions that have been found in the United States since at least the early 1900s. ** 2. A small sub-set of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" ("Roaches & Bed Bugs")songs/rhymes include the words "I'm singing eenie meenie miney moe/catch a whipper whopper by the toe/if he hollers let him go (or "don't let him go")/eenie meenie miney moe".

** 3. "Whipper whopper" is by far the most often used form of this compound noun (referent). Other forms that I have come across are "wiffer woffer","wiffer waffer", and whifferwhaffer". I also have come across one example of that song that includes the line "catch a whippersnapper by his toes". Smarky Marlarky (Indiana), Oct. 2, 2012, http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=286551

"Eenie meenie miney moe Miney moe, catch a whippersnapper by the toe And if he, if he hollers, hollers, let him go Singing eenie meenie meenie, miney moe" -end of quote-

That commenter shares a version of the "Eenie Meenie Miney Moe" counting out rhyme that he or she remembers from the 1950s (which includes the n word). However, no date was given in that comment for that version of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning"..
** 4. The examples of this sub-set that I found online of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" all have this same or very similar wording and structure that serves as the chorus (refrain) for those compositions: "I'm singin' eenie meenie and a miney moh
Catch a wiffer woffer by the toe
And if it hollers, hollers, hollers,
Let it go, I'm singin' Eenie meenie and a miney moh" ** 5. A number of the examples in this sub-set of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" ("Roaches & Bedbugs") songs have the words "eener meener" as a sub-title and/or as a preface to the "eenie meenie miney moe" refrain. I haven't come across the words "eener meener" elsewhere. ** 6.The "Eenie Meenie Miney Moe"/Whipper Whopper" sub-set of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" (Roaches & Bedbugs) has the same verse structure and floating verses as the much larger portion of that song/rhyme. Those floating verses can be found in certain other children's recreational rhymes, particularly in extended versions of "Miss Susie Had A Steamboat". Some versions of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" (with or without the "Eenie Meenie Miney Moe"/Whipper Whopper" chorus has the same verses as the children's recreational rhyme "Miss Lucy Had A Baby".  

** 7. I haven't found any online definition for the terms "whipper whopper" or "wiffer woffer" etc.

** 8. I haven't found any other forms of "Eenie Meenie Miney Moe" in "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" ("Roaches & Bed Bugs") songs/rhymes. For instance, there are no examples of "Catch a tiger by its toes" or "catch a piggy by its toes" in these "Eenie Meenie Miney Moe" forms of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" ("Roaches & Bed Bugs") songs/rhymes.

** 9. I haven't found any definitive date that the "Eenie Meenie Miney Mo" sub-set of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" was first chanted or sung, which means that I haven't found a definitive source for those songs/rhymes.

By "definitive source" I mean a particular record, or a television episode, newspaper article etc that introduced that wording into earlier versions of those rhymes/songs. I also haven't come across any definitions about what "whipper whopper" or "wiffer woffer" means.

** 10. Most examples of this sub-set of songs use the pronoun "his" instead of "its" for references to "Whipper Whopper" ("wiffer woffer" etc.), for instance, "catch a whipper whopper by his toes" instead of "by its toes". Therefore, in the examples of the songs that use the pronoun "his", the term "whipper whopper" (or a similarly spelled compound noun) refers to a man.

****

Here are other speculations (guesses) I've made about this sub-set of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" ("Roaches &Bed Bugs") songs/rhymes: 1. My guess is what I call the "Whipper Whopper" sub-set of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" ("Roaches & Bedbugs" songs was first sung/chanted in the United States in the 1950s. The 1950s was the decade when some people in the United States began to substitute a word like "tiger", "monkey", "piggy" as a replacement for the "n word". That word had been sung in "Eenie Meenie Miney Moe" songs/rhymes since the late 19th century, but some White people finally began to acknowledge that it was pejorative. I believe that the intention of these replacement words in "Eenie Meenie Miney Moe" songs/rhymes wasn't to replace the "n word" with a socially acceptable way of saying the same thing, but to (at least publicly) move away from the use of that word that they acknowledged was pejorative. In the same way that the word "tiger", or "piggy", or "monkey" aren't usually perceived as a hidden way of saying "the n word" in "Eenie, Meenie, Miney, Moe" songs/rhymes, I don't think that the referent "whipper whopper" ("wiffer woffer") are a hidden or euphemistic way of "saying the n word". ** 2. My guess is that the word "whippersnapper" (meaning an impertinent young person) was used first and was later changed by folk processing to those other forms ("wiffer woffer", wiffer waffer" etc,) After the popularity of the Burger King "Whopper" menu item, those "wiffer woffer etc. were later changed by the folk process to "whipper whopper".

**
3. My guess is that the word "whipper whopper" is the most often used form of the referent in the "Eenie Meeney Miney Moe" sub-set of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" ("Roaches & Bedbugs") songs/rhymes because of peoples' familiarity to the word "whopper" as a result of the Burger King fast food restaurant's "Whopper" hamburger. That menu item was introduced in 1957.

From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whopper "The Whopper is the signature hamburger and an associated product line sold by the international fast food restaurant chain Burger King and its Australian franchise Hungry Jack's. Introduced in 1957, the hamburger has undergone several reformulations, including changes to portion size and bread used. The hamburger is well known in the fast food industry, with Burger King advertising itself as "the Home of the Whopper" and naming itskiosk stores the BK Whopper Bar. In response to the Whopper, Burger King's competitors have developed similar products designed to compete against it."...

From https://www.britannica.com/topic/Burger-King-Corporation "A large hamburger called the Whopper is Burger King’s signature product. The Whopper was introduced in 1957, at a time when its competitor McDonald’s was still selling only small hamburgers."

** 4. My guess is that few people who sing or chant examples of these "Eenie Meenie Miney Moe" sub-set of "I Woke Up Sunday Morning" consider or care about what the words "whipper whopper" or other forms of those words mean. **** This concludes Part I of this two part pancocojams series. Thanks for visiting pancocojams. Visitor comments are welcome.