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Sunday, October 20, 2024

A 2010 Journal Article Excerpt About Haitians and African Americans in The Mattapan Neighborhood Of Boston, Massachusetts

Edited by Azizi Powell

This pancocojams post presents an excerpt from the Wikipedia page about Mattapan (a neighborhood in Boston, Massachusetts (retrieved October 20, 2024).

This post also presents an excerpt of a January 2010 Trotter Review journal article by Alix Cantave, University of Massachusetts Boston, entitled "Incorporation or Symbiosis: Haitians and African Americans in Mattapan". 

The content of this post is presented for historical and socio-cultural purposes.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to Alix Cantave for this research and writing. Thanks to all others who are quoted in this post.
-snip-
Click 
https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2024/10/why-havent-black-people-in-united.html for a related pancocojams post entitled "Why Haven't Black People In The United States Been More Supportive Of Haitian Immigrants In Springfield, Ohio Who Are Being Falsely Accused Of Eating Cats & Dogs? (a YouTube discussion sub-thread)"

Reading that many of the comments in that 2024 YouTube sub-thread echoes and/or clarifies the reasons for some of the points that were made in that 2010 journal article.

****

INFORMATION ABOUT MATTAPAN

From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mattapan
:Mattapan ,,,is a neighborhood in Boston, Massachusetts, United States. Mattapan is the original Native American name for the Dorchester area,[1] possibly meaning "a place to sit."[2] At the 2010 census, it had a population of 36,480, with the majority of its population immigrants.

[…]

20th century

At the turn of the 20th century, the population of Mattapan was largely Caucasian, but starting in the late 1960s, blockbusting intentionally designed to destabilize the neighborhood drove many long-term residents out of Mattapan.[11] In the 1980s, a significant number of Haitians immigrated to Mattapan, leading to the current demographic population. Mattapan has become an important center for the Haitian cultural, social, and political life in the state of Massachusetts. As of 2015, Mattapan also has a large population of African Americans, Jamaicans, and other Caribbean immigrants.[12] During the 1960s and 1970s, Mattapan underwent a major change in the makeup of its population. It shifted from a predominantly Jewish neighborhood to one that is now largely African American and Caribbean American having a population of 37,486 that is over 77% African American and Caribbean American.[13]

[...]

Demographics

[…]

Today Mattapan is seeing another major population shift, albeit a natural turn over of housing, as a large number of immigrants from Haiti and other Caribbean countries continue to move in. Mattapan now has the largest Haitian community in Massachusetts, and is also largely made up of African Americans and immigrants from other Caribbean countries.[3] In 2013 the population in Mattapan was 36,299. Of this total 11% were Caucasian, 82% were African American, 1% were Asian, 2% were a mixed race, and 6.5% were devoted to other races.[15] According to the Boston Redevelopment Authority 72.4% of the population living in Mattapan were born in Massachusetts, 23.6% were born outside of the state, and 3.2% were born outside of the United States.“…

****
JOURNAL EXCERPT
From https://scholarworks.umb.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1005&context=trotter_review
Trotter Review, Volume 19, Issue 1: Where is Home? Immigrants of Color in Massachusetts, 
Article 7, January 2010

"Incorporation or Symbiosis: Haitians and African Americans in Mattapan" (by) Alix Cantave,
University of Massachusetts Boston [pages 107-122]

"Haitians and African Americans have long historical bonds and a common history. This historical connection between African Americans and Haitians has less impact on contemporary relations between the two groups than would be expected. Current generations perceive African American and Haitian relations as a by-product of Haitian migration to the United States, disregarding nearly 200 years of history.

[...]

(page) 107

[...] 

The image of an impoverished people seeking political and economic refuge from its own society underlies contemporary African American and Haitian relations. It is the image of a large number of Haitians arriving at American shores and airports.

Largely uninformed of the historical bonds that exist between them, the

(page)110

present generations of Haitians and African Americans find themselves in an uneasy coexistence marked by cultural and language differences aggravated by miscommunication and misconceptions. These differences greatly influence relations between members of the two groups who find themselves sharing the same neighborhoods in Boston, South Florida, and New York City. In describing her experience as a Haitian immigrant in New York City in the mid-1970s, the social linguist Flore Zéphir illustrates the stance of Haitians in America:

            "I arrived in this country in 1975, I could not help noticing that the Haitian community was a                 closed community, and that Haitians’ lives outside of work revolved around Haitians. I do not
             recall meeting non-Haitians at Haitian's gatherings, no do I recall Haitians telling me about
            their attending the gatherings of  "others" " (Zephir 1996)                                                                                                                                                           

As Haitians continue to move to the United States in large numbers seeking economic opportunities and refuge from political repression and environmental degradation, their relationship with African Americans has also become more obvious. Haitians are settling in larger numbers in predominantly African American neighborhoods, and their U.S.-born children identify with African Americans and face many of the same issues as black youth in urban America. As Zéphir observed, Haitians remain an isolated group. This group centripetality greatly influences the relationship between Haitians and African Americans as well as how African Americans perceive Haitians as a group. …

[…]

(page) 110

[…]

Haitians in the United States
There are no exact counts of the number of Haitians in the UnitedStates. Some estimates have placed the number of Haitians in the country at about 2 million, including immigrants, the undocumented, and
those who claim Haitian ancestry....Based on the various sources and counts, an estimate of 2 million Haitians and Haitian Americans in the country is reasonable. More-systematic demographic work is warranted to determine a more accurate count.

The vast majority of Haitians in the United States are concentrated in Florida, New York, Massachusetts, and New Jersey. These four states account for 89 percent of the Haitian-born population in the country.

Massachusetts, with about 44,000 Haitian-born residents, has the thirdlargest population. About 43 percent, or 19,000, of the state’s Haitian population live in Boston (2000 Census; BRA 2007). In fact, Haitians represent 10 percent, the largest share, of Boston’s foreign-born population. Addi-

(page) 112

tionally, Haitian-born residents represent about 14 percent of Boston’s black population. As the map below shows, Mattapan and Hyde Park are the two Boston neighborhoods with the largest concentration of Haitian immigrants. Mattapan also has the largest percentage of blacks in the city of Boston.

Mattapan

...Since the 1980s, Mattapan has been experiencing another demographic shift. Large numbers of Caribbean immigrants have arrived and are continuing to move into the neighborhood. Mattapan currently has the largest Haitian population in Massachusetts. The presence of the Haitian population in Mattapan is evident by the number of Haitian churches, businesses, social service agencies, and other institutions. Mattapan also has a number of religious, service, and business institutions that historically catered to the African American population. Those institutions are also changing to reflect the latest demographic shift. The newly arrived Haitians live next to African Americans who have been in Mattapan for more than 50 years. While Mattapan is generally classified as a low-income neighborhood, it has a solid middle-class enclave. Similar to other inner-city neighborhoods, Mattapan faces a multitude of challenges that require active community engagement and the participation of all residents.

Mattapan has long been characterized by high crime rates, high street-gang activities, and high poverty rates. In fact, Mattapan has one of the higher neighborhood distress index scores in Boston, based on a
matrix developed by Professor James Jennings of Tufts University (Jennings 2009).

Mattapan also has the highest density of African Americans and Haitians in Boston...Haitian native Creole speakers in Limited English Proficiency classes had the highest increase

(page) 113

in high school dropout rates in Boston Public Schools between 2003 and 2006 (Mauricio Gastón Institute 2009). The dropout rate from Haitian LEP students increased from 3.6 percent in 2003 to 10.6 percent in 2006, nearly a threefold increase. Haitian youths are also deeply involved in neighborhood violence, both as victims and perpetrators....

The destinies of Haitians and African Americans in Mattapan are connected by a new common struggle and the spatial realities of sharing the same neighborhood. Both groups fail to understand those shared realities. Organizations serving the neighborhood acknowledge them but have done little to address them. In addition to Mattapan, Haitians in Boston are concentrated in the four neighborhoods with the highest black population density and the highest scores on the distress index: Mattapan, Hyde Park, Dorchester, and Roxbury.

African American and Haitian Coexistence in Mattapan

A preliminary analysis of the Mattapan survey data shows signs of what Professor Glenn Jacobs of UMass Boston describes as centripetality and centrifugality among Haitians in Mattapan. Haitian adults as well as Haitian-based organizations tend to be ethnocentric and are less likely to form cross-ethnic ties or establish meaningful community relationships with African Americans. Haitians in Mattapan still live in a closed community similar to what Zéphir found in New York City more than three decades ago. Haitian and African American adults appear to coexist in Mattapan amid a web of misconceptions, misunderstandings, and other sociocultural barriers that prevent the two groups from forming community ties that can strengthen the community. African Americans and Haitians in Mattapan worship in different churches, speak different languages, frequent different businesses, and, to some degree, buy food from different supermarkets. African Americans and Haitians see Mattapan
differently.

Haitians often refer to Mattapan as “the Haitian community".

[…]

(page) 114 

[...]

Haitian views are consistent with how community was defined by participants of the focus groups conducted by the Trotter Institute and CCBR at the Dana-Farber Cancer Institute. The most common definitions of community,

(page) 115

based on the focus group results, are: (1) a group of people with the same norms and culture who are united together; (2) a group of people who have the same idea, who have the same cultures, and who live in the same area; and (3) a group of people from the same place who speak the same language and live in the same area. One participant describes community as “a group of people with the same norms and culture who are united.” Throughout the focus groups, men and women referred to the Haitian community as a particular entity. They did not refer to “the community” as the neighborhoods in which they lived. The Haitian informants described Mattapan as the center of the Haitian community with a large concentration of services and businesses catering to Haitians. They also think that Haitians represent the majority of Mattapan’s population. African Americans described Mattapan as an ethnically diverse community that has gone through many demographic transitions, a community that transitioned from being predominantly Jewish to predominantly black in the 1960s and 1970s. They see Mattapan as being predominantly African American with a significant Caribbean population, including Haitians.

Both groups agreed that a significant portion of Mattapan’s population is Haitian. Haitians believed they are the majority. One Haitian informant said, “The majority of Mattapan’s population is Haitian.” Another stated that “Mattapan has the largest concentration of Haitians, as well as Haitian businesses and services.” On the other hand, an African American informant described Mattapan as “an ethnically-diverse neighborhood in transition, with a significant middle-income African-American population.”

There are several areas of agreement between African Americans and Haitians. One was the issues that they think affect all residents of Mattapan. African American and Haitian informants agreed that they include education and poor-quality schools, crime, and health disparities. Among the most critical issues facing Mattapan, the informants mentioned the lack of affordable housing and an inadequate number of services. The detached relationship between African Americans and Haitians, however, hinders their ability to come together to address the issues that they agreed are affecting the neighborhood and both groups.

The poor or nonexistent relationship between the groups is another area where African Americans and Haitians agreed. The two groups coexist with limited interaction in a manner that one key informant described

(page) 115

as “cordial, but no integration” in a kind of a “fragile peace”; or as another informant observed: “There are no conflicts between Haitians and African Americans because there are no interactions.”

On the other hand, Haitian youths are more likely to incorporate into the larger black community and form cross-ethnic and cross-national ties. Haitian adults asserted that Haitian youth assimilate faster and become identified with African Americans, or “Americanized.” This view is also consistent with how focus group participants perceive Haitian youth acculturation, which is seen as contributing to delinquency, poor school performance, and involvement in crime and violence. Basically, by becoming acculturated, according to the informants and focus group participants, Haitian youths abandoned their “old ways” (Haitian) and became delinquent—what Alejandro Portes and Rubén Rumbaut have identified as negative incorporation (Portes & Rumbaut 2006). This is a statement not only about the acculturation of Haitian youths in the African American community but also the perception of some Haitians of African Americans. Thus, the isolation of Haitians in Mattapan can be described as an attempt to maintain their “old ways” and resist negative incorporation. On the other side, African Americans see Haitians as different, poor people from a poor country who speak a different language, dress differently, who keep to themselves, have loud parties, and who do not respect the community. One African American informant stated that Haitians are unaware of the struggle of African Americans toward equality and civil rights so that all blacks can enjoy the freedom and opportunities that this country offers. Further, she stated that Haitians do not

 [This is a revised form for a chart inserted in this page]

Descriptions of Haitians in Mattapan

African Americans

Not invested in the community

Isolated—not integrated in the community

Transient—don’t stay in the community for long

Work too much and leave children unattended

Lack of civic engagement

Focus on education

Think they’re better than African Americans

 

Haitians

financially Invest in businesses in Mattapan

Isolated

Upwardly-mobile oriented

Hardworking

Haitian youth well-behaved

Haitian businesses cater only to Haitians

Poor relations with African Americans


(page) 116

understand that they have benefited from the gains and struggles of the civil rights movement. The table [above] shows some examples of how African American informants described Haitians in Mattapan and how the Haitian informants described themselves.

The reality, however, is that Mattapan is the most diverse black neighborhood in Boston, with a mixture of African Americans and blacks from the Caribbean and Africa. Mattapan is also the center of the Haitian community, with the highest density of Haitian businesses, churches, and social service agencies in Boston. Mattapan-based agencies and community organizations provide services to the larger community, irrespective of national origin or ethnicity. Haitians also access many of the services that are provided in the neighborhood via Mattapan Family Service Center, Mattapan Community Health Center, and the Church of the Holy Spirit. One of the concerns that African American informants voiced is the fact that Haitian businesses and services are very ethnocentric; they tend to serve Haitians and employ only Haitians. When African Americans carp about the lack of Haitian investment in Mattapan, they are referring to the ethnocentric tendencies of Haitian-owned businesses and Haitian-based organizations. On the other hand, when Haitians talk about their level of financial investment in Mattapan, they are referring to the services that they have provided primarily to other Haitians. Haitian businesses and services contribute to the neighborhood and Boston’s economy. According to a Boston Redevelopment Author ity report, Haitians in Boston own 108 small businesses, which contributed $222 million to local output and spent $219 million (BRA 2007). The Mattapan community has contributed to the vibrancy of the Mattapan Square, the neighborhood’s commercial center. In fact, Mattapan Square is one of the few places in the neighborhood where Haitians and African Americans cross paths.

Where African Americans and Haitians Interact

All of the informants agree that Mattapan has no definite places that facilitate and promote cross-ethnic interactions. Informants named churches as likely venues for intergroup interaction, but as several informants mentioned, each group also has its own churches. Services in Haitian churches are often in Haitian Creole or French and, therefore, not 

[...]

(page) 117
accessible to the vast majority of the African American population. Members of the two groups do attend services at St. Angela’s Roman Catholic Church on Blue Hill Avenue. The service that many Haitians attend, however, is conducted in Haitian Creole and does not provide a space for cross-ethnic interaction.

Haitian and American informants stated that the Jubilee Church on Blue Hill Avenue has the most diverse congregation. As a member of Jubilee explained, the church is very diverse, with a significant number of African American, Haitian, African, and Caribbean members. The church brings speakers that reflect the diversity of its membership. The church does not intentionally address issues of cross-ethnic or cross-nationality collaboration or interaction.

Several informants echoed the lack of community facilities, common space, and activities that can foster cross-ethnic interaction. For instance, informants mentioned the lack of community centers and youth leagues and athletic teams as an impediment to interethnic collaboration and interaction. Due to lack of intentional facilities and activities, different groups meet accidentally in Mattapan Square, the area where different groups from the neighborhood shop and access public transportation.

Mattapan CBOs and African-American and Haitian Interaction in Mattapan

Another area Haitian and African American informants agreed on is the minimal role that community organizations in Mattapan are playing in promoting interethnic collaborations and interactions. An informant from a local service provider stated that “we have not sponsored any activities to develop relationships between African Americans and Haitians because we don’t see it as a problem.” Another informant stated that “when Haitians are invited to community meetings or events, they don’t show up, and when they do, they don’t return.” Haitian organizations do sponsor activities to promote intergroup interaction, a Haitian informant from a Haitian-based organization claimed. He cited the Haitian Day Parade as an example. The Haitian Day Parade is an activity that promotes Haitian pride. Several other groups participate in the actual parade but not in planning the annual event. It is also an advertising opportunity for businesses targeting the Haitian market. In fact, some informants see the

(page) 118

Haitian Day Parade as another example of the ethnic schism that divides Mattapan and prevents better group collaborations. This is how one informant perceives the culturally specific carnivals, including the Haitian Day Parade: “I think that it is unfortunate. Every culture is going for itself.

         "You know, we used to have, for example, a Caribbean festival. Now we have a Haitian festival,             Jamaican festival, Cape Verdean festival, Dominican festival. Everybody is kind of going for
         themselves when before we were really one. Black people went to it, and everyone went to it. It’s
         kind of like we celebrate together. But now you have three or four going on, and I think it is a
         way to separate us.”

[…]

The shrinking pool of funding is forcing organizations to simultaneously compete and collaborate. Groups have realized that they must chase the same funding and sometimes collaborate in order to be more competitive. That bow to expedience does not mean that organizations developed a common agenda or vision, however. One of the executive directors clearly expressed that view when he said that "While groups in Mattapan are working more together, I am not aware of any common agenda or space.” Haitian organizations are serving Haitians and collaborating with African American–led organizations when it is financially or organizationally advantageous. African American–led organizations expand their services to Haitians and hire Haitian staff members because it is good business practice to respond to the changing demographics of Mattapan that have brought the growth in the Haitian population. While the organizations acknowledge the need for more interaction and collaboration between African Americans and Haitians, they have not been able to facilitate and promote that interaction.

--There is no common space for Haitians and African Americans

--to interact in Mattapan…. Organizations are not in position to

--create that space due to lack of institutional interests. Agencies can work together, but there is no common agenda. (Haitian informant May 2008)

(page) 120

Conclusion

Mattapan is a diverse black community with significant African, African American, and Caribbean populations. Haitians are the most significant black immigrant population in Mattapan, a vibrant community with a very active commercial center. Mattapan is also a community with significant challenges. It is among the most distressed neighborhoods in Boston, as measured by a number of demographic and socioeconomic indicators, including poverty, educational attainment, and crime. The
neighborhood also lacks sufficient community facilities and the common social space to encourage and facilitate interethnic collaborations and interactions. The relationship between African Americans and Haitians in particular is marked by miscommunication, misunderstanding, and misconception. The two groups have not been able to build on a shared history of common struggles. Haitians form a closed community, removed from the challenges that the neighborhood faces, ignoring that their children are impacted by the same issues that are affecting all black youths in Mattapan. These issues include gang violence, poor-quality education, a lack of youth services, and a lack of after-school programs. Organizations serving Mattapan have done little to promote interethnic collaboration to address some of the challenges that the neighborhood faces. The churches, which many informants said reflected the rich diversity of the neighborhood, have not fostered conversations among their members and neighborhood residents about interethnic or intergroup collaboration as a strategy to address the many challenges that the neighborhood faces. Haitians and African Americans coexist in Mattapan in a fragile
peace in a cloud of misconception about culture, jobs, and inequality in services and their allocation. As many informants explained, 15 years ago there were a lot of conflicts and tensions between Haitians and African Americans. Haitians and African Americans have gotten accustomed to each other’s presence and coexist in an uneasy peace in a now-quiet Mattapan, except when gang violence flares. The neighborhood is infested with gangs, with one on virtually every street. The organizations serving Mattapan have an obligation to the neighborhood and its residents to begin the process of interethnic cooperation in order to improve the quality of life of all residents. Churches with Haitian and African American mem-

(page)122

bers can have group discussions on interethnic collaboration and sponsor events to encourage communication between African Americans and Haitians. The organizations serving the neighborhood already have access to both populations. They can sponsor educational and social events to encourage intergroup interaction. For instance, health disparities affect Haitians and African Americans. The organizations can cosponsor a neighborhood health fair where Haitians and African Americans can talk about common concerns about issues that affect their health status.

Similar events can be held on a number of topics, including housing, education, crime, employment, and political representation. This may be the first step in formulating a common agenda for Mattapan and to create an inclusive community, as opposed to a divided space in which different groups merely coexist.”
-snip-
This excerpt doesn’t include acknowledgment section.]

****
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Why Haven't Black People In The United States Been More Supportive Of Haitian Immigrants In Springfield, Ohio Who Are Being Falsely Accused Of Eating Cats & Dogs? (a YouTube discussion sub-thread)

Edited by Azizi Powell

Latest edition - October 21, 2024

This pancocojams post presents information about the false accusations that were made by Republicans during the 2024 Presidential campaign that the Haitian immigrant population in Springfield, Ohio were stealing, killing, and eating pets in that community.

This post also provides a complete sub-thread from a YouTube video on another subject in which commenters responded to the question ""Why are Black people in the USA not coming out strongly against the tarnishing of Black immigrants from Haiti in Springfield?"

The content of this post is presented for historical and socio-cultural purposes.


All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to all those who are quoted in this post.
-snip-
Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2024/10/a-2010-journal-article-excerpt-about.html for a related pancocojams post entitled "A 2010 Journal Article Excerpt About Haitians and African Americans in The Mattapan Neighborhood Of Boston, Massachusetts."

Reading that 2010 journal article echoes and/or clarifies the reasons for some of the points that were made in the comments in this 2024 YouTube sub-thread. 

****
INFORMATION ABOUT THE SITUATION REGARDING THE HAITIAN POPULATION  IN SPRINGFIELD, OHIO 
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Springfield_pet-eating_hoax
"Starting in September 2024, baseless claims spread online that Haitian immigrants were stealing and eating pets in Springfield, Ohio. The claims began with a local Facebook group post claiming a local cat had been butchered, and spread quickly among far-right and neo-Nazi groups. The claims were then amplified by prominent figures in the American right, most notably Republican Senator and vice-presidential nominee, JD Vance of Ohio, followed by his running mate Donald Trump and allies such as Laura Loomer and Twitter owner Elon Musk.[1][2] Subsequently, the author of the original Facebook post and the neighbor who told her the story admitted it was based on a rumor from people with whom they had not spoken.[3][4]

Springfield and county law enforcement said that no credible reports or evidence support the claims, and the city's mayor and Ohio Governor Mike DeWine, who are both Republicans, have denounced them.[5] The claims were widely described as racist.[6][7][8] Fact-checking website Snopes called the claims unfounded, while others characterized them as a hoax or a lie.[9][10] When challenged on the factual basis of the claims, Vance told interviewer Dana Bash, "If I have to create stories so that the American media actually pays attention to the suffering of the American people, then that's what I'm going to do".[11]

The pet-eating claims spread amid existing racial tensions in Springfield, where recent legal Haitian immigration strained some public resources. There had been previous incidents of hostility towards the local Haitian community and unfounded local rumors of Haitians stealing waterfowl for food.[12] After the claims spread, dozens of bomb threats targeted Springfield schools, hospitals, public buildings, and businesses, often accompanied by anti-Haitian messages."... 

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PANCOCOJAMS EDITOR'S NOTE ABOUT THIS POST 
This is the complete sub-thread that is an off-topic comment exchange that is part of a discussion thread for a YouTube video entitled "Black Men Think Very Carefully Before Voting For Trump! | Will You Get The Tangibles You Want" (published by TheDefiantLawyers on September 18, 2024. This YouTube channel is hosted by two African American attorneys (father (Augustus Corbett) and daughter (Chloe Corbett). As of October 20, 2024 at 1:57 Am EDT there has been a total number of 324,667 views for this video. As of the same time there are a total number of 6,068 comments in the entire discussion thread and 58 comments in this showcased sub-thread.. The entire sub-thread as of October 20, 2024 is quoted in this pancocojams post with numbers added for referencing purpose only. This sub-thread doesn't include a comment that I attempted to add to that sub-thread two times but for some reason both attempts were deleted after they appeared in that sub-thread for a brief time. My comment was in response to comment #42 in this sub-thread which asks about the meaning of the word "tether". I didn't copy the original version of my comment which was longer than my second version. That first version included the title of a pancocojams post on Foundational Black Americans (FBAs) and Americans Descendants Of Slaves (ADOS), but didn't include a link to that post. I thought that mentioning my blog post might have been the reason why my comment was deleted since that could have been interpreted as self-promotion. Therefore I didn't mention my pancocojams blog or that post in my second attempt to add a comment to that discussion thread. I'm sharing the second version of my comment after the last comment that appears in that sub-thread as of this date. This pancocojams post also includes the link to my post on FBA, ADOS, and their relatively newly coined meaning for the English language word "tether" as a specific population referent. **** YOUTUBE VIDEO SUB-THREAD ABOUT THIS SPRINGFIELD, OHIO PET EATING HOAX

1. @byronhay1648, September 2024
"Why are Black people in the USA not coming out strongly against the tarnishing of Black immigrants from Haiti in Springfield? It also reflects on every black wherever you come from."

** Reply
2. 
@Bambi7ish, September 2024
"
We are! ✅️💪🏽💯"

**
Reply
3. 
@divinebynature7056, September 2024
"
How do you know some are'nt? Is anyone from the Black immigrant community talking about the young man, Javion MaGee who was alledgedly lynched?  Don't come in here with that bullcrap. There are many things to be concerned about."

** Reply
4. 
@ursamajor6347, September 2024
"
Because we have allowed social media mouthpieces to condition us into “otherizing” Black people who from the US. The introduction of terms like ADOS and FBA into our vocabulary was purposely part of the conditioning."

** Reply
5. 
@MPMMPM-vy9cu, September 2024
"
If you're not Black, then you don't know. Don't comment if you are unschooled on the subject!"

**
Reply
6. 
@byronhay1648, September 2024
"
@Bambi7ish  Thank you."

**
Reply
7. 
@Tiffany-ki4wu,September 2024
"
Some of us is King we are very outraged and has spoken up."

** Reply
8. 
@Michael-w2d3g, September 2024
"
Because these Haitian 'Tethers' get to the US and talk greasy about FBA's!🤔"

** Reply
9. 
@roberthboyd6073, September 2024
"
Yes true"

** Reply
10. 
@onlyalisaawilliams, September 2024
"
We are, but some have self hate, don’t label all of us with them.. Y’all have to learn the loudest mouths online doesn’t represent the majority , and we as Black American’s have a responsibility  to get loader than them, and that’s our fault we haven’t."

** Reply
11.
@msimareallady8664, September 2024
"
It's so much trauma, distractions, and issues that's happening. it's almost too overwhelming."

**
Reply
12. 
@lorrainehurt3044,September 2024
"
We need to take care of ourselves. Has any other Blacks from other countries come to our aid in all these years?!"

** Reply
13. 
@judymuttari5929, September 2024
"
Yall don't stand up for us and we return the favor, plus yall think ya better than blacks."

** Reply
14. 
@keithcaldwell1871, September 2024
"
Because we don’t stick together"

** Reply
15. 
@keithcaldwell1871, September 2024
"
Because we never stick together"

** Reply
16.
@sparkle3000, September 2024
"
@lorrainehurt3044  Kendrick Lamar is attempting to do just that.
We help all these groups but they don't  help us back.
Time to look out for themselves."

** Reply
17. 
@rdhawk929, September 2024
"
Never thought I'd get this kind of treatment here. I'm out. Comment keeps getting deleted."

**
Reply
18. 
@sparkle3000, September 2024
"
@rdhawk929  Me too, sad isn't it.
Keep posting the truth."

** Reply
19. @goldenfreedom7361, September 2024
"
 @lorrainehurt3044 with out the Haitian revolution,the will never be such thing as the Louisiana purchase in the American history. And secondly, more than 500 Haitian soldiers fought in the siege of Savannah Georgia during the American revolution war in 1779. Just saying... You could research that my sister. I ❤️ YOU MY SISTER. PLEASE BE SAFE, AND STAY BLESSED..🙏🏿🙏🏿🙏🏿"

** Reply 20. @taq1238, September 2024
"
​@lorrainehurt3044 There are so many who have joined in the struggle. Is it likely that you would have heard that I, as an immigrant, was part of an organization that abolished the death penalty in the state I live in?

Are you familiar with Stokely Carmichael aka Kwame Ture? He is a famous activist who came from the Caribbean.

I suspect that the narrative is more important for far too many than the facts.

** Reply 21. @rochcarothers-ts3jx, September 2024
"
@MPMMPM-vy9cu Good point,so form us ?"

** 22. @rochcarothers-ts3jx, September 2024
"
Trump axes DEI🇺🇸📜🗽⚖️"

** 23. @rosalindgriffin6940, September 2024
"
Amen!!"

** Reply
24. 
@FunnkDrummer, September 2024
"
Self hatred on both sides."

**
Reply
25. 
@lorrainehurt3044,September 2024
"
@goldenfreedom7361  I stand corrected 👍🏿"

** 26. @lorrainehurt3044, September 2024
"
@taq1238  I stand corrected 👍🏿"

**
Reply
27. @MOLICIOUS69, September 2024
"
@divinebynature7056 exactly you handled that perfectly 🙏🏿"

**
Reply
28. @rosalindgriffin6940, September 2024
"
@FunnkDrummer  Well, guess what I will be voting blue. I have sons and I want my sons to make it home!!@"

** 30. @missyhockett, September 2024
"
Some think their black is better than another black."

** Reply
31. 
@shawnfromstatefarm8822, September 2024
"
@lorrainehurt3044 Plenty actually, if you used Google for what it’s supposed to be used for. And when exactly are you going to “take care of yourselves”?

**
Reply
32. @RasheedGazzi, September 2024
"
When have you EVER seen an immigrant speak up for the people who made it possible for them to have the rights they have now? Still I'm willing to stand on their side."

** 33. @RasheedGazzi, September 2024
"
@missyhockett Some don't even want to identify as Black."

** Reply
34. 
@AntarrahGilkes, September 2024
"
Do you remember Marcus Garvey and his contribution to the raising of the plight of black people in America? He was the father of 20th century black progressive movement....his UNIA sought to uplift Afrikan Americans. ​@lorrainehurt3044"

** Reply
35. 
@cheriagata6408,September 2024
"
@Michael-w2d3g exhibit 1 of division"

** 36. @williamcarter9066,September 2024
"
Have you talk to every black person in America to assume what you said in that very general statement!! I know haven’t interacted with me !! However it goes like this whatever I do or feel about the Haitians ITS STILL NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS people are allowed their own feelings and don’t have to group think to appease others!!"

** 37.@evylouis3122, September 2024
"
@Michael-w2d3g don’t generalize all Haitians please. Black is black in some our eyes. African Americans paved the way so it would be ignorant to say otherwise."

** Reply
38. 
@patricemccauley8486, September 2024
"
Absolutely!!!!!!"

**
39. @cheriagata6408,September 2024
"
@lorrainehurt3044 emphatically yes! Unlike black Americans they just join the cause without holding signs saying Haitian Jamaican African etc! They are right there with you! They have American kids too! They care bc unless they speak and you hear an accent, the system just see Black especially those Haitian people who mind their own business"

** 40. @cheriagata6408,September 2024
"
@goldenfreedom7361 the ignorant ones are the loudest and most indignant right ! If they knew Haitian history they’d know that we need to revere these people and hold hands with them because the West still has its boots on their necks! They were the first to rid themselves of slavery and they valiantly fought to help others including South America! Respect to the Haitians! They have helped you and continue to do so because black includes Haitians!!"

**
41. @cheriagata6408, September 2024
"
@evylouis3122 actually denigrating blacks is every black person’s business! Like it or not we are all lumped as one! Frankly Haitians have a rich history of fighting for themselves and others including the USA. We have to learn to stick up for one another!"

** 42, @FreeAtLast-d8n, September 2024
"
@Michael-w2d3g What’s a tether?"

** 43. @goldenfreedom7361, September 2024
"
@lorrainehurt3044  All love my sister.❤️"

** Reply
44. @byronhay1648, September 2024
"
@judymuttari5929  Sir, by definition, as long as you are of African descent, you are black. And they treat us all the same way. No matter where you come from we’re are in the same boat; and have been and should be supporting each other. Stop the division. Bob Marley and Marcus Garvey (African Jamaicans) spoke for all blacks and other oppressed people."

** 45. @goldenfreedom7361,September 2024
"
@cheriagata6408  most certainly. Totally agreed... This is the right time to pass such infos, and be teachers to those that have no idea why they are  who they are philosophically about Haiti/Haitians.. What may seem bitter for Haitians now, will turned out to be a blessing. Watch and see. ONE L❤️VE. Stay positive, and stay blessed 🙏🏿🙏🏿🙏🏿"

**
Reply
46. 
@lorrainehurt3044, September 2024
"
@goldenfreedom7361  Thawadah my brother. Shalawam ❤️🙏🏿"

** 47. @goldenfreedom7361, September 2024
"
@lorrainehurt3044  You are welcome anytime. And may peace be you as well always. Inshallah...🙏🏿🙏🏿🙏🏿❤️"

** Reply
48. 
@PowerWithinMe-tm6yt, September 2024
"
 @cheriagata6408 👏👏👏👏 thank you ❤❤"

** 49. @blackfreethinker2525, September 2024
"
This

Non

Divesting

Ethnic

Black

American


DEFINITELY HAS BEEN!

Don't MESS with Ayiti! 🇭🇹"

**

50. @lorrainehurt3044, September 2024
"
@AntarrahGilkes  I know about Garvey and the 60s. It's 2024. Who has stood up for us since then? We were fighting for Apartheid in 90s, Rawanda. Always fighting for Africa. Look even at the CBC, they aren't worth a penny. We've always spoken for other groups. We spoke out when Katrina hit Haiti. We spoke out for Puerto Rico a couple years ago. Get my drift. It's been decades since any other groups have spoken up for the crimes and mistreatment of us."

**
51. @cynthiabakerwoodard, September 2024
"
Just a new twist on an old practice: always some type of movement in our community for some segment to separate from the larger black community to identify with the dominant culture. It is complicated and sad. It is based in fear and historic self-hatred. More recently, over the last couple of decades, we saw black self-hatred grow in the manifestation of public degradation and hate toward black women. We failed to see where this was heading. I don’t believe that we are truly surprised that it is estimated that an alarming percentage of polled black men plan to vote for white supremacy to control our nation going forward. Can’t blame Trump. He has consistently been transparent about his beliefs and commitment to his feelings about black folks for decades."

**
52. @blackfreethinker2525, September 2024
"
 @Michael-w2d3g  divestor babble."

**
53. @senica41, September 2024
"
BLACK AMERICANS NEED TO WORRY ABOUT BLACK AMERICANS ❤"

** 54.@speedial3696, September 2024
"
@lorrainehurt3044 in what are expecting help from Africa when the majority of are still being oppressed by super power nations .

These poor souls are in worse predicaments than we are."

Have compaction my friend and make the right arguments."

** 55. @whatstherealproblem7513, September 2024
"
Because someone said that when the immigrants come to America and get in politics they fight against reparations and this goes for all immigrants that get in politics they also say they are tired of immigrants getting all the good tangibles while black Americans getting turned down."

** 56. @mammawlee, September 2024
"
Thank you! That is a good question!"

** 57. @samuelhntr1986, September 2024
"
@cheriagata6408 👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👍🏾👍🏾🙏🏾"

** 58. @CindyPage-n3m, October 2024
"
AMEN 🙏🙌"
-snip-
Here's the second version of my comment that I attempted to add to this discussion sub-thread on 
Oct. 19, 2024 at 10:56 PM:

Azizip171
"@FreeAtLast-d8n  "tether" (when used as a noun) is a derogatory lineage population referent for Black people from the Caribbean, Africa, and elsewhere who emigrate to the United States. This referent is used by Black people who are FBA/ADOS and their supporters or Black people who are influenced by those lineage movements. In no way am I supportive of this usage."
-snip-
My first version of this comment included a sentence such as "For more information about Foundational Black Americans (FBA) and American Descendants Of Slaves (ADOS) as well as information about the meaning of the term "tether" which 
(I believe) was coined and regularly used by FBA's leader and spokesperson Tariq Nasheed, read my pancocojams post entitled "Article Excerpts About The Population Referents "ADOS" (American Descendants Of Slaves) And "FBA" (Foundational Black Americans)".

-snip-
Here's the link to that June 2024 post (which I didn't add to either version of the comment that I attempted to add to that sub-thread:
https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2024/06/article-excerpts-about-population.html

I plan to publish a pancocojams post about the word "tether" ASAP and will add that link to this post.

****
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Friday, October 18, 2024

Black Americans Comment About Kamala Harris' Racial Identity (from the discussion threads of two Reese Waters YouTube videos about Kamala Harris' Fox News interview)