Examples & Videos Of The Hand Clap Rhymes "Ribena Sassatina" (and similar names)

Neil Robbie, Jul 20, 2010

 The Queen and the Joker with a different rhyme: Ribena, Sassatina. From their playground in Wolverhampton, UK. -snip- "The Queen" and "the Joker" are nicknames and/or stage names for Neil Robbie's daughter and son. -snip- The words to this version of "Ribena Sassatina" are given as #1 in the selected examples section of this post. **** Edited by Azizi Powell

This is Part II of a two part pancocojams series on the "Ribena*" hand clap rhyme.  This post presents information about Ribena soft drinks. This post also showcases several videos of the Ribena hand clap rhyme and features some examples of that rhyme.

* Notice the different versions of this rhyme's title in these examples. It appears that this rhyme is known by the first word only. The second word "Sassatina" and similar words are meaningless words that rhyme with the word "Robina". 

Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2024/01/papz14-every-kid-in-primary-school.html for Part I of this pancocojams series. That post showcases papz14's video short/Tik Tok video clip of that rhyme and presents selected comments from the discussion thread for that Tik Tok video. These comments help document how this hand clap rhyme and other rhymes that are mentioned were actually played by these commenters in some British primary schools.

Information about Ribena [brand] soft drinks is also included in that pancocojams post.

Brief information about papz14 is also given in that post.

The content of this post is presented for folkloric, cultural, and recreational purposes

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to all those who are featured in the videos that are included in this post and thanks to all the publishers of those videos. Thanks also to all those who are quoted in this post. 
-snip-
Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2024/01/examples-videos-of-hand-clap-rhymes.html for information about and examples of the hand clap rhyme "Lemonade Crunchy Ice". That rhyme has the same tune as "Ribena" (the name of a brand of British soft drinks). "Ribena" rhymes are also similar to "Lemonade Crunchy Ice" as they both end with their chanters "freezing" in place.  

****
PANCOCOJAMS EDITOR'S NOTE
"Ribena" is a hand clap rhyme that originated in Great Britain where Ribena soft drinks originated. I'm from the United States and I'm not familiar with Ribena soft drinks or with Ribena hand clap rhymes.

I think that the word "Ribena" is pronounced "rye-BEAN-ah". 

Is this how that word is pronounced?

****
The textual pattern (words) and the tune for the hand clap rhyme "Ribena" is the same as the hand clap rhyme "Lemonade, Crunchy Ice" and the beginning portion of both rhymes are also the same. Click https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75Npwwobdqg for a YouTube video of  "Lemonade Crunchy Ice". 

****
INFORMATION ABOUT "RIBENA" SOFT DRINKS
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ribena
"Ribena … is a brand of blackcurrant-based soft drink (both uncarbonated and carbonated), and fruit drink concentrate designed to be mixed with water. It is available in bottles, cans and multi-packs. Originally of English origin, it was produced by the pharmaceutical company GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) until 2013, when the brand was sold to Japanese beverage conglomerate Suntory.

The brand originally had a strong reputation as a healthy product for children, stemming from its distribution to children as a vitamin C supplement during World War II by the British government. Beecham, a company that has been part of GSK since 2000, bought the brand in 1955 and developed many soft drink versions. A series of scandals in the 2000s, concerning vitamin C levels, sugar levels, and the amounts of actual fruit in some of the brands, damaged its reputation as a healthy product, and by 2013, the brand was widely regarded as a soft drink.[1]"...

****
SHOWCASE VIDEO #2 -Ribena Hand-Clapping Game



Families, August 25, 2017

Ribena Sassatina Dumb boy Smart girl Ribena Sassatina


****
SHOWCASE VIDEO #3 - Me and my sister doing Ribena handshake 🤝 have fun watching!!

Sreshta Nellagiri, Nov 23, 2019
-snip-
Here's my transcription of this version of "Ribena". Additions and corrections are welcome.

Tic Tac Toe
Give me a high
Give me a low
Give me a three in a row
Ribena [clap clap clap]
Sasatina [clap clap clap]  
Big girls
Lazy boys
dot dot dot [The girls turn around in place while saying that word.]
Ribena
Sasatina
Big girls
Lazy boys.

****
SHOWCASE VIDEO #4 - Ribena hand clap ( short video) 🤑🤑🤑🤑🤑🤑🤑😎😎😎😎💙❤️😝😝😝😝

 

Alex Ezeike, Jan 7, 2019
-snip-
Based on their accent, I think these girls aren't from the USA. Since the examples of  "Ribena" that I've found online are all from Great Britain, my guess is that this is where these girls are from.
-snip-
Here's my transcription of this rhyme. Additions and corrections are welcome. 

Ribena 
Sasatina   
Big girls 
Crazy boys 
Ribena
Sasatina
Big girls
Crazy boys.

****
SELECTED EXAMPLES OF & COMMENTS ABOUT THE RHYME "RIBENA"

These examples are given in no particular order. Numbers are added for referencing purposes only.

Online Source #1

https://thevicarswife.blog/2010/08/02/playground-rhymes-2-ribena-sassatina/

Playground Rhymes 2: Ribena, sassatina

2 August, 2010 by thevicarswife

"More than a year ago I blogged a video of the Queen and the Joker reciting one of their favourite playground rhymes. This has attracted a few comments both on the blog and on YouTube, so I thought I’d share another favourite Wolverhampton rhyme here.

Here they are reciting Ribena, Sassatina (full lyrics below the video). I’m not sure what it is with soft drinks. And what is Sassatina, anyway? And apologies for the Queen’s stripes/flowers combo. She has her own fashion sense…

Ribena (clap, clap,clap), sassatina (clap, clap,clap).

Big boy (clap, clap,clap), crazy girl (clap, clap,clap).

Ribena, sassatina.

Big boy, crazy girl.

Statue, baby."

****
Online Source #2

Playground Rhymes I did when I was in primary school (2007/2008 - 2013)

posted by Unknown, 11 July 2013, https://hellothere-areyoulost.blogspot.com/2013/07/ribena.html

RIBENA

[clapping game]

"Ribena (clap,clap,clap), sassasina (clap,clap.clap), big boys (clap,clap,clap), crazy girls..."

then you do it quickly only clapping once.

"Ribena, Sassasina, big boys, crazy girls statue/freeze

The first one to move is the loser."

****
Online Source #3
https://www.reddit.com/r/irishproblems/comments/c5w8zq/playground_hand_clapping_games/
1. irishproblems, 2018
"Playground hand clapping games!

Hi there! My sister and I were trying to remember our hand clapping games from when we were kids and the rhymes to go with. If anyone can remember some of them that would be so fab!"

**
Reply
2. C_Whorriskey, 2018
"Maybe ribena? Ribena clap clap clap sackatina clap clap clap big boys clap clap clap lazy girls clap clap clap (speed up) ribena sackatina bigboyslazy girls...

Then you just keep getting faster til yis mess up"
-snip-
Italics is found in the original comment in this discussion thread.

****
Online Source #4
From https://www.tiktok.com/@papz14/video/6933187411400854789, published by
 Papz14,  2021

1. hdhejejwnwne, April 12, 2021
"i used to say “ribeena super seena” LOL"

**

2. Javxd.1, April 12, 2021

"@nrgfaridh12 @shad0w_clan100 ours would be ribena Argentina Ali sena has a tiny wener"

**
3. Mista_rizz, April 27, 2021
"its armella super sella😂😂😂"

**
4.  Hi, May 20, 2021
"Did anyone do " Anna Ella super Stella"

**
5.  ☼✰𝙉𝙖𝙯𝙯𝙮 𝙉𝙤𝙧𝙧𝙞𝙨✰☼, April 30, 2021
"Ours was “amela, super Stella, tall boys, and crazy girls,”"

**
6. . AF💫, June 25, 2021
"I thought it was zacka zeena @alesha.priv1"
-snip-
I believe that these are Black British women and men's memories of this rhyme. Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2024/01/papz14-every-kid-in-primary-school.html for the pancocojams post about this Tik Tok video & discussion thread. 

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Online Source #5
From https://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=410642&page=4 "old school hand games"

Random parent, 2018
"In school we would do the clapping games e.g…

Ribena, super cena, 10 boys,8 girls, ribena super cena 10 boys 8 girls gotcha"

****
Online Source #6
From GUEST NK, 18 March 11, https://mudcat.org/thread.cfm?threadid=63097 Folklore: Do kids still do clapping rhymes?

Ameena *clap clap clap* Superstina *clap clap clap* Lazy boys *clap clap clap* Super girls *clap clap clap* *now faster* Ameena Supersteena Lazy boys Super girls S T O P STOP *no one moves* The first to move loses and the last to stay in one position without moving wins.

****
This concludes Part II of this pancocojams series.

Thanks for visiting pancocojams.

papz14 - "Every Kid In Primary School": "Ribena" British Handclap Rhyme (Comedy Video With Information, Lyrics, & Comments)

 

papz14, Feb. 25, 2021

Ribena SaSa SinA #fyp #foryou #school #comedy #uk
-snip-

In this video papz14, a young Black male from the United Kingdom, mimics how primary school girls chant the rhyme "Ribena" including freezing like a statue at the end of the rhyme.

****
Edited by Azizi Powell

This is Part I of a two part pancocojams series on the "Ribena*" hand clap rhyme. 

This post showcases papz14's video short/Tik Tok video clip of that rhyme and presents selected comments from the discussion thread for that Tik Tok video. 

These comments help document how this hand clap rhyme and other rhymes that are mentioned were actually played by these commenters in some British primary schools.

Information about Ribena [brand] soft drinks is also included in this pancocojams post.

Brief information about papz14 is also given in this post.

Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2024/01/examples-videos-of-hand-clap-rhymes.html  for Part II of this pancocojams series. That post showcases several other videos of the Ribena hand clap rhyme and features some examples of that rhyme.

The content of this post is presented for folkloric, cultural, and recreational purposes

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to papz14 for this video and thanks to all those who are quoted in this post. 
****

INFORMATION ABOUT "RIBENA" SOFT DRINKS
Excerpt #1
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ribena
"Ribena … is a brand of blackcurrant-based soft drink (both uncarbonated and carbonated), and fruit drink concentrate designed to be mixed with water. It is available in bottles, cans and multi-packs. Originally of English origin, it was produced by the pharmaceutical company GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) until 2013, when the brand was sold to Japanese beverage conglomerate Suntory.

The brand originally had a strong reputation as a healthy product for children, stemming from its distribution to children as a vitamin C supplement during World War II by the British government. Beecham, a company that has been part of GSK since 2000, bought the brand in 1955 and developed many soft drink versions. A series of scandals in the 2000s, concerning vitamin C levels, sugar levels, and the amounts of actual fruit in some of the brands, damaged its reputation as a healthy product, and by 2013, the brand was widely regarded as a soft drink.[1]"...

****
Excerpt #2
From https://www.suntory.com/brands/ribena/
"Ribena

A favorite in the UK, Ribena is a fruit juice beverage beloved by generations of consumers since it was first released in 1938. Packed with vitamin C and available in a variety of flavors, Ribena can also be found in Africa, Asia, and Oceania.

Ribena is made from 100% British blackcurrants and available in a range of luscious flavors and beverage types, including original and light, so consumers of any age can enjoy fantastic fruity flavors, whatever the occasion.

****
INFORMATION ABOUT PAPZ14
papz14's YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/@papz1458 includes this statement: "hi my names papz14 . I’m just a kid from south london who loves creating.

****
PANCOCOJAMS EDITOR'S NOTE
"Ribena" is a hand clap rhyme that originated in Great Britain where Ribena soft drinks originated. I'm from the United States and I'm not familiar with Ribena soft drinks or with Ribena hand clap rhymes.

I think that the word "Ribena" is pronounced "rye-BEAN-ah". 

Is this how that word is pronounced?

**

The textual pattern (words) and the tune for the hand clap rhyme "Ribena" is the same as the hand clap rhyme "Lemonade, Crunchy Ice" and the beginning portion of both rhymes are also the same. Click https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75Npwwobdqg for a YouTube video of  "Lemonade Crunchy Ice". 

****
WORDS FOR PAPZ14'S VERSION OF RIBENA (HAND CLAP RHYME)

Ribena
SaSa Sina
Big boys
Crazy girls
Ribena SaSa Sina
Big Boys
Crazy Girls
Statue 
Make a statue


-snip-
Additions and corrections are welcome.

****
SELECTED COMMENTS FROM THE TIKTOK THREAD FOR THIS PAPZ14 VIDEO:

https://www.tiktok.com/@papz14/video/6933187411400854789, publishing date Feb. 25, 2021

Numbers are added for referencing purposes only. Brief explanatory notes are given after some of these comments.

1.adnan, Feb. 25, 2021
Memories😭😭

**
2. gachagirl_xox0, Feb. 25, 2021
"It’s armela supa sella in my school 🏫"

**
3. Sasha💕🍋, Feb. 25, 2021
"Lemonade crunchy ice anyone?"

**
Reply
4. xxx, Feb, 25, 2021
"And then ‘the sailor went to sea sea sea to see what he could see see see’"

**
Reply
5. deedeekayy, Feb. 25, 2021
"😂😂😂😂😂😂cmonnn"

**
6. 💐, Feb. 25, 2021
"@asma9282 UMM CHILE- THIS IS JUST IS SOOO REALISTIC 😔👍"

**
Reply
7. Papz__ · Creator, Feb. 25, 2021
"You sure ?"

**
Reply
8. Mista_rizz. , Feb. 25, 2021
"thats what my school did lol😂😂"

**
Reply
9. Maira_J, Feb 25, 2021
"yh"
-snip-
"yh" = "yeah"

 **
Reply
10. ⁉️⁉️
"Yea"

**
Reply
11. 𝑎𝑛𝑎𝑖𝑦𝑎ℎ, Feb. 25, 2021
"yh it is"

**
12. salma ♡, Feb. 25, 2021
"What happened to aamella"

**
13. y, Feb. 25, 2021
"I wonder what the year 2’s are doing now😂😂😂😂😂😂😂"
-snip-
https://www.brightworldguardianships.com/en/guardianship/british-education-system/
"The education system in the UK is divided into four main parts, primary education, secondary education, further education and higher education.

The education system in the UK is also split into "key stages" which breaks down as follows:

Key Stage 1: 5 to 7 years old
Key Stage 2: 7 to 11 years old
Key Stage 3: 11 to 14 years old
Key Stage 4: 14 to 16 years old"...
-snip-
Key Stages 1 & 2 basically corresponds to "elementary" school in the United States. Key Stage 3 partly corresponds with "Middle" (formerly "Junior High ") school in the United States and Key Stage 4 partly corresponds with "High school" which usually extends to age 18 years or possibly older.  

**
Reply
14. Papz__ · Creator, Feb. 25, 2021
"Doing tik toks 😂😂😂😂"

**
15. Jahed, Feb. 25, 2021
"It’s acc Armella Supercella"
-snip-
"acc"- actually

**
Reply
16. Papz__ · Creator, Feb. 25, 2021
"U SURE???"

**
17, IS, Feb. 25, 2021
"year 2 memories thank you😂"

**
18. neha, Feb. 25, 2021
"papz feeling that statue 👀😭"

**
Reply
19. m, Feb. 25, 2021
"YOU CAN NEVER FOR GET THE STATUE😂😂😂"

**
20. 🇬🇧🇦🇫, Feb. 25, 2021
"Amella?? Anyone??"

**
21. ريما🤍, April 10, 2021
"@ahlam.sufi not us still doing this in science 😂"

**
22.Humaira, April 11, 2021
"Naa its drink it once drink it twice turn around touch the groud FREEZE"

**
23. hdhejejwnwne, April 12, 2021
"i used to say “ribeena super seena” LOL"

**
Reply
24. Javxd.1, April 12, 2021
"@nrgfaridh12 @shad0w_clan100 ours would be ribena Argentina Ali sena has a tiny wener"

**
25. 𝓐𝓶𝓲𝓻𝓪𝓱✨️, April 18, 2021
"we used to say crazy girls n lazy boys 😂😂😂"

**
26. hollywastakennn, April 21, 2021
"We did “statue” at the end and I added “ oFfFff lIbErTyyYyy” and everyone thought I was super cool 😎"

**
27.  lix🇧🇩🇬🇧, April 21, 2021
"OMGGG- MY BFF KEPT ON DOING THAT WITH ME AND I WAS LIKE wth are we doing-"

**
28 .,  April 25, 2021
"remember milk man milk man do ur duty here comes misses Macaroni. she can do the pom pom she can do the splits all she needs is a kiss kiss kiss"

**
29. Duy Beni, April 26, 2021
"Every kid in my school: RIP THAT ______ AYYYYYYY”
-snip-
"RIP that" = "killed that", meaning "did that all of the time"

**
Reply
30. N, May 9, 2021
"So true😂😂😂"

**
3`. Mimi🇯🇲🇦🇬, April 26, 2021
"🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣 I’m creasing rn😭💔"
-snip-
"creasing rn" = laughing hard right now

**
32. 💌, April 27, 2021
"@joanna.spamzzz2 @rajna.rb @zoroneedstochill @atikah.ax @alisha_t2 BRO WAT WE WERE DOING AT BREAK 😫😭😭😭"
-snip-
"break" = recess - school time after lunch before classes begin again 
**

Reply
33. Mista_rizz, April 27, 2021
"its armella super sella😂😂😂"

**
34. bella, April 28, 2021
"Did anyone else do this this thing in primary where the girls in like break or something rhyme saying “alton towers all across the hours salt pepper"
-snip-
"break in" = British informal use {?) meaning "added", "combined", "included"

** 
35. ☼✰𝙉𝙖𝙯𝙯𝙮 𝙉𝙤𝙧𝙧𝙞𝙨✰☼, April 30, 2021
"Ours was “amela, super Stella, tall boys, and crazy girls,”"

**
36. jszo, May 2, 2021
"@g0th1c.s0ul OMG THIS WAS IT"

**
37. Amina🤍🕊, May 4, 2021
"Bro statue💃🏽😂 @iamsara.s @simrah.xs"

**
38. shaq🔛🔝, May 4, 2021
"@no4.jay @wagwan.comm the girls did it all the time bru"

**
Reply
39. iluvmavencalore, May 10, 2021
@mary.an14 and now we playing uno and dobble😂
-snip-
"uno"= https://www.calculators.org/games/uno/
"This is a popular card game for kids where each player tries to run out of cards first."

Click https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uno_(card_game) for information about the game of Uno.
-snip-
Dobble = https://www.dobblegame.com/en/games/

"Dobble is a speed and observation game for the whole family. The aim of the game?

 Each two cards have one symbol in common. Be the first to find and name it to win the card."
-snip-
"Uno" is an American originated game that is well known in the United States. I've never heard of the game "Dobble" before. I asked my 10 year old granddaughter and she said she hadn't heard of it. I don't know if "Dobble" is known in the United States or not .

**
40. ز🤍, May 9, 2010
"@hollyslickhair I DID THIS EVERYWHERE IN PRIMARY"
-snip-
"Primary" = in Britain this is key Stages 1 and 2 as described above

**
41. Yaser ER, May 10, 2021
"Ya

ser 🇪🇷Girls used to get so pressed abt ‘crazy girls’ and change to ‘crazy boys’ 😂"

**
Reply
42. H., May 10, 2021
"@amera_12xo STOP ✋🏾😭"

**
Reply
43, beatriz_368, May 10, 2021
"I literally thought this handshake thing was in my school only

When I saw this on my fyp

I started laughing soo

Hardddd 😂😂😂"
-snip-
"fyp" = Facebook page
 
**

Reply

44, anisa, May 10, 2021
"@d.1ana__ us in the playground"

**
45 . mish, May 13, 2021
"THE PHOTO BEHIND IS LITERALLY MY OLD PRIMARY SCHOOL-"

**
Reply
46. glossypanda1, May 15, 2021
"the sailor🚣🏽‍♀️went to 🌊 🌊 🌊 to see what he could see see see but all that he could see see see was the bottom of the deep blue 🌊 🌊 🌊"

** 
47. 𝓳𝔁𝔂𝓬𝓮❦, May 16, 2021
"@notts.felicia @leah_coops17 this brings lower key stage primary school vibes"

**
Reply
48. its_debbie, May 16, 2021
"apple sticky makes me icky was a classic 👌"

**
49. s, May 16, 2021
"OMG LMFAO I REMEMBER THIS 😂😂"

**
50. @itss__aishaa, May 16, 2021
"let's change that to big girls lazy boys"

**
51. fatima🤍, May 17, 2021
"In our school we did unicorn mermaid BuNnY"

**
52, anna irené, May 17, 2021
"@m36.xo1 so true we changed the lyrics"

**
Reply
53. makemeviral402, May 17, 2021
"Why is this so true tho😂"

**
54. Hi, May 20, 2021
"Did anyone do " Anna Ella super Stella"

**
Reply
55. laila🫶🏽, May 21, 2021
"we used to say ArmElLa sUpeRsELa 😭😭"

**
56. we all yung 😏,May 21, 2021
"I remember when we all used to fight about "its BIG GIRLS CRAZY BOYS"😂😂😂"

**
Reply
57. hey there:)), May 22, 2021
"We all did “statue belly button” LMFAO AND WE WOULD POKE EACHOTHER"

**
58. zena, May 22, 2021
"I would always change it to “Big girls crazy boys” to piss of the boys 😂😂"

**
59. AF💫, June 25, 2021
"I thought it was zacka zeena @alesha.priv1"

****
This concludes Part I of this two part pancocojams series.

Thanks for visiting pancocojams.

Visitor comments are welcome.

"Mixed" & Other Racial/Ethnic Group Categories In The United Kingdom: Background Information & 2021 Census Results for Britain and Wales

Edited by Azizi Powell

This pancocojams post presents some online excerpts about "Mixed" and other racial/ ethnic group categories in the United Kingdom.

The content of this post is presented for historical and educational purposes.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to all those who are quoted in this post.

****
ONLINE EXCERPTS

(These excerpts are given in no particular order and are numbered for referencing purposes only.) 

EXCERPT #1
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mixed_(United_Kingdom_ethnicity_category)
"Mixed is an ethnic group category that was first introduced by the United Kingdom's Office for National Statistics for the 2001 Census. Colloquially it refers to British citizens or residents whose parents are of two or more different races or ethnic backgrounds. The Mixed or Multiple ethnic group in England and Wales numbered 1.7 million in the 2021 census, 2.9% of the population.[4]

A number of academics have pointed out that the ethnicity classification employed in the census and other official statistics in the UK since 1991 involve confusion between the concepts of ethnicity and race.[5][6] Aspinall notes that sustained academic attention has been focused on "how the censuses measure ethnicity, especially the use of dimensions that many claim have little to do with ethnicity, such as skin colour, race, and nationality".[7]

2001 was the first census which asked about mixed race identity. In that census, 677,177 classified themselves as of mixed ethnicity, making up 1.2 percent of the UK population.[8] The 2011 Census gave the figure as 2.2% for England and Wales.[9]”…

****
EXCERPT #2
From https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/style-guide/ethnic-groups Ethnicity facts and figures

GOV.UK

List of ethnic groups

In England and Wales, there is an agreed list of ethnic groups you can use when asking for someone’s ethnicity. The groups are usually those used in the Census, which happens every 10 years.

If you’re in a government service team, there’s a design pattern for asking users for equality information, including their ethnic group.

1. 2021 Census

The main changes to the 2021 Census of England and Wales, compared with the previous Census, were:

-the ‘Roma’ group was added under the ‘White’ ethnic group

-a write-in response was added for the ‘Black African’ ethnic group

The ethnic groups were:

Asian or Asian British

Indian

Pakistani

Bangladeshi

Chinese

Any other Asian background

Black, Black British, Caribbean or African

Caribbean

African

Any other Black, Black British, or Caribbean background

Mixed or multiple ethnic groups

White and Black Caribbean

White and Black African

White and Asian

Any other Mixed or multiple ethnic background

White

English, Welsh, Scottish, Northern Irish or British

Irish

Gypsy or Irish Traveller

Roma

Any other White background

Other ethnic group

Arab

Any other ethnic group

 

In Wales, ‘Welsh’ is the first option in the White category.

2. How the groups were chosen

The Office for National Statistics runs the Census of England and Wales every 10 years. They decide which ethnic groups to include in consultation with:

 -users of Census data (like government departments, local authorities, and the National Health Service)

-people completing the Census, and the interest groups that represent them

-the organisations that run the Censuses in Northern Ireland and Scotland

It is recognised that these ethnic groups do not represent how all people identify. People are encouraged to write in their ethnicity using their own words if they don’t identify with any groups in the list.

There has been an ethnicity question in the Census since 1991. It has been updated at every new Census since then. There are separate questions in the Census about national identity, religion and language.

[...]

3. Exceptions

The Government Statistical Service (GSS) has a harmonised standard for ethnicity classification.

The ethnic groups used in the harmonised standard and the latest Census are usually the same. The harmonised standard is being reviewed and currently uses the ethnic groups from the 2011 Census.

4. Scotland and Northern Ireland

The Censuses in Scotland and Northern Ireland use different ethnicity classifications.

Northern Ireland

The ethnicity question in the 2021 Census in Northern Ireland asked people to choose from the following ethnic groups:

Black African

Black Other

Chinese

Filipino

Indian

Irish Traveller

Mixed ethnic group

Roma

White

Any other ethnic group

Scotland

Scotland’s next Census is in 2022. The ethnic groups will be:

Asian, Scottish Asian or British Asian

Pakistani, Scottish Pakistani or British Pakistani

Indian, Scottish Indian or British Indian

Bangladeshi, Scottish Bangladeshi or British Bangladeshi

Chinese, Scottish Chinese or British Chinese

Other

African, Scottish African or British African

Respondents write in their ethnic group

Caribbean or Black

Respondents write in their ethnic group

Mixed or multiple ethnic group

Respondents write in their ethnic group

White

Scottish

Other British

Irish

Polish

Gypsy or Traveller

Roma

Showman or Showwoman

Other

Other ethnic group

Arab, Scottish Arab or British Arab

Other (for example, Sikh, Jewish).

[...]"
-snip-
The bold font was used in this original online page.

****
EXCERPT #3

From https://www.migrationmuseum.org/census-reveals-new-chapter-in-story-of-mixed-race-britain/

Census reveals new chapter in story of mixed-race Britain

Posted by Matthew Plowright, December 7, 2022

[…]

Please note: this post quotes historical individuals who used racist language and terminology.

" “Someone must have the courage to strike a warning note.”

His feet pound the stoney streets. Mist looms over Cardiff. Children of all backgrounds laugh and play nearby. The warm “smell of curry and rice”, as one local described it, greets them. It’s the 1920s, and Police Chief Constable James Wilson is on the verge of entering the history books.

Wilson was “concerned by Tiger Bay’s reputation for immorality and mixed-race marriages”, so wrote to his local police committee. “Half-caste children had a vicious hereditary taint of their parents,” he said, as reported by the BBC documentary ‘Mixed Britannia’.

“The time may come,” he continued, “when public opinion will awaken to the fact that our race has become leavened with the coloured strain. Someone must have the courage to strike a warning note.”

In 1929, Wilson called for a new form of social control. He was an advocate for the sort of laws used in South Africa, which would ban sexual contact between races. The issue erupted in the press, with some journalists supporting Wilson’s move. It was a menacing attack on the mixed community in Tiger Bay.

In the early twentieth century, mixed-race communities had emerged in seaports around Britain, like in Cardiff’s Tiger Bay. Seamen of all races and backgrounds, many British citizens themselves, had come from across the empire to live and work in these ports. The British empire was multicultural – and so it helped make Britain itself multicultural in turn. As the Sri Lankan writer Ambalavaner Sivanandan put it: “We are here because you were there”.

When the seamen arrived and worked, some of them fell in love. Thousands of mixed-race children were born from South Shields to Glasgow, Liverpool to London. But no community was as proudly mixed as Cardiff’s Tiger Bay, or Butetown, as it was also known. It’s a place where the whole community of different races would come out to celebrate Eid together. Quite a beautiful image, you might think… unless you were called ‘James Wilson’ – who wanted to go to battle.

But then Wilson’s direction of travel suddenly, violently veered off. World War Two erupted, and he was drafted into a different kind of battle than he had anticipated.

Fast forward a few years, and Wilson was back in Cardiff. He had survived. Been knighted, even. And when he returned home, the mixed Tiger Bay community was still there. Was the battle about to resume?

But something curious happened next. After witnessing the atrocities committed by the Nazis, Wilson had a change of heart. As he looked around Tiger Bay, Wilson approved. He no longer wanted mixed relationships stopped or Tiger Bay’s community disbanded. Now Wilson saw it as something to aspire to, a shining example of tolerance. His campaign to bring in British miscegenation laws was over.

Years later, another surprise came. A member of the Wilson family married a mixed-race person, making him a part of the very kind of family he once sought to destroy.

***
It’s important to discuss communities like Tiger Bay, and the historical threat they faced. Britain rarely has a narrative in the public domain about mixed-race history. With the latest census releasing, could now be the time to start one?

The census is an endlessly fascinating freeze-frame of Britain at this moment.

[...]

Ethnicity statistics for England and Wales from the 2021 Census are now available. They show dramatic shifts in the population. The headline; 1.7 million in the two nations identify as mixed-race. That’s a tripling since 2001.  When Scotland and Northern Ireland’s data comes out soon, this number will rise further. 

[...]

Let’s dig a little deeper into the numbers. ‘White and Black Caribbean’ people remained the largest ‘Mixed’ population group – 513,042 people identified as such, up 20% from the 2011 Census. But other Mixed groups saw faster growth. The number of people identifying as ‘White and Asian’ rose 43% to 488,225; ‘White and Black African’ rose 50% to 249,596.  ‘Other Mixed or Multiple Ethnic Groups’ showed the fastest growth: up 61% to 467,113. This underlines that England and Wales’ mixed population is becoming increasingly diverse.

While Cardiff and other port cities were home to Britain’s first mixed communities, London is now the centre of our mixed population. In the Migration Museum’s home borough of Lewisham, 24,253, or 8.2% of the population, identified as Mixed. This is the largest proportion in any area in England and Wales. Indeed, the top 10 areas with the largest proportion of mixed-race populations are all in London.

[…]

But dozens of areas far from London and traditional port city mixed communities now show sizable mixed populations, too: Nottingham (5.9%), Wolverhampton (5.4% ), Cambridge (5.2%) and Reading (5.1%), to name a few.

[…]

The pace at which the people who live in Britain are changing is extraordinary. It matters – especially if you root this moment back in our history.

[...]

Mixed-race history matters, yet is rarely told. It’s a story about one of the fastest-growing groups of people in the UK, yet we rarely hear from them together. It’s time to change that."
-snip-
The words that are written in bold font or in italics that are found in this excerpt were written that way in the article.

Here's the link for the hyperlinked words [census statistics are] "now available" -  https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/culturalidentity/ethnicity/bulletins/ethnicgroupenglandandwales/census2021

****
Thanks for visiting pancocojams.

Visitor comments are welcome.

Selected Comments From A 2012 Online Discussion About Young White Londoners "Talking Black"

Edited by Azizi Powell

This pancocojams post showcases selected comments from a 2012 online discussion thread entitled "Why Do Young White Londoners Talk Black Style?".

The content of this post is presented for folkloric, linguistics, and socio-cultural purposes.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to all those who are participated in this discussion and all those who are quoted in this post. YouTube.
-snip-
This is part of an ongoing pancocojams series on "African American Vernacular English", "code switching" and other related linguistics customs.

Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2017/07/selected-youtube-discussion-thread.html for a closely related pancocojams post entitled "Selected YouTube Discussion Sub-Thread About Whether Black People From Britain "Talk White".

Also, click the tags below to find other posts in this series.

****
DISCUSSION EXCERPT
Pancocojams Editor's Note:
The full discussion is seven pages (169 comments).

I recognize that other people compiling excerpts of these comments might choose to highlight some other comments than the ones that I chose.

https://forums.digitalspy.com/discussion/1667825/why-do-young-white-londoners-talk-black-style
radyag
28/05/12 #1
"I've noticed in recent years that the classic cockney accent has now gone. Young people now speak in what I call black style, or gangsta. I can only assume this is the effect of mass immigration in London."

**
ladymoanalot
28/05/12 11:45
#2
"When I was in London working I hardly heard anyone talk like that. Well apart from a gang of rough looking ones, in their early teens.."

**
flagpole
28/05/12 11:51
#6
radyag wrote:
I've noticed in recent years that the classic cockney accent has now gone. Young people now speak in what I call black style, or gangsta. I can only assume this is the effect of mass immigration in London.

"if you stop calling it black style and refer to it as something like urban youth culture then the question of why the urban youth do it becomes more apparent."

**
Talullahmay
28/05/12 11:52
#8
radyag wrote:
I've noticed in recent years that the classic cockney accent has now gone. Young people now speak in what I call black style, or gangsta. I can only assume this is the effect of mass immigration in London.

"I don't think it's just london though tbh, I live in manchester & it's the same with some white guys & girls here!"

**
alisonrose3764
28/05/12 12:15
#20
"Cos they think its SO cool - shame they don't know they look totally stupid!
Its the jeans halfway down their bum that makes me laugh - what a pathetic look!
I'm so glad I am a grown-up!"

**
stoatie
28/05/12 12:25
#25
"I think I must have missed the meeting where all the rules changed and adults were supposed to be able to understand why teenagers do stuff."

****
https://forums.digitalspy.com/discussion/1667825/why-do-young-white-londoners-talk-black-style/p2

skp20040
28/05/12 13:08
#31
"Its a faux Jamaican patois, and it sounds ridiculous in white people ( I actually have a white Jamaican friend and it still sounds odd ) , especially young ladies ( and I use the word ladies in the loosest possible of terms ) .

But we can all speak in a Jamaican accent if we want, try saying Beer Can and you will find it sounds like Bacon in a Jamaican accent."
-snip-
Pancocojams Editor: The bold font was included in this comment

**
pickwick
28/05/12 13:10
#32
flagpole wrote:
if you stop calling it black style and refer to it as something like urban youth culture then the question of why the urban youth do it becomes more apparent.
Heh, yes, this :D

"Anyone who actually thinks accent is tied to race is hilariously ignorant about language. (Not that being ignorant is hilarious in itself, just when they're trying to look down on other people from their lofty perches of ignorance.)"

**
whydoiwatch
28/05/12 13:10
#33
stoatie wrote:
I think I must have missed the meeting where all the rules changed and adults were supposed to be able to understand why teenagers do stuff.

"Same here. You think I would've been issued a manual since I have kids. I guess I'm still waiting on "The Black Person's Guide to Being Black: How You Are All The Same Regardless of Ethnicity, Nationality, Class, Culture or Religion." I've been doing this black thing for almost 35 years but according to DS,I'm doing it wrong."

**
Ber
28/05/12 13:27
#38
"All the white kids round here sound just like they were born and raised in Lagos :rolleyes:

(Saying that, I do love the Nigerian / Ghanaian accent)"

**
Bex7t6
28/05/12 13:32
#41
"I heard this accent being discussed on the radio recently. Seems more of an influence of environment rather than white kids trying to talk 'black', whatever the f**k that is. I know a fair few black people who don't talk in the way being descibed.

From Wikepedia- http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multicultural_London_English
Although the street name, "Jafaican", implies that it is "fake" Jamaican, researchers indicate that it is not the language of white kids trying to "play cool" but rather that "[it is] more likely that young people have been growing up in London exposed to a mixture of second-language English and local London English and that this new variety has emerged from that mix"."
-snip-
Pancocojams Editor: That word was written with asterisks in that discussion thread.

**
lala
28/05/12 13:53
#49
radyag wrote:
I've noticed in recent years that the classic cockney accent has now gone. Young people now speak in what I call black style, or gangsta. I can only assume this is the effect of mass immigration in London.
" "black style"? Surely you mean AMERICAN street talk?

But hey, let's not blame the other cultures in the west for this now. :rolleyes:"

****
https://forums.digitalspy.com/discussion/1667825/why-do-young-white-londoners-talk-black-style/p3

**
skp20040
28/05/12 14:00
#53
pickwick wrote
Yeah, but you only "know" (or assume) that London kids' Jamaican-style accent is put on because of their race, I guess is what I mean, really. I know quite a few people who have "put on" a false accent, but because it was broad Glaswegians or Cornish people "putting on" an Estuary or Standard English accent, nobody thinks it sounds stupid or they're weird fakers. Largely because they're going from low-status accent to higher-status accent, I think. And conversely that's why people think the Jafaikan sounds "wrong" and "stupid" and "unnatural" - because people are choosing to use a lower status accent, and that's just weird ;)

"It's not that the white kids are choosing to use a Jamaican accent though anyone choosing to use an accent other than their own I find a bit sad , no accent to my mind is low-status , an accent is an accent , but its that they are specifically choosing a gangsta aspect of that which is made up and they do it to come across as hard ."

****
Ber
28/05/12 14:13
#55
"Thing is, I know quite a few jamaican people and their accents don't sound anything like "street slang" - so I'm not sure why its called "Jafaican" (unless its just because you can insert the word fake into it)"

**
SillyBoyBlue
28/05/12 15:34
#70
"It's funny that black kids aren't accused of 'talking white' when their accent is as far removed from their grandparents' native Jamaican accent as white kids' are from theirs.

"Innit" is a "white" cockney word. Both black and white kids have grown up in a multi-cultural environment where the various accents have blended. I agree though that certain words ("Feds" for example) have been picked up from exposure to American rap culture, but this 'Jafaican' thing was obviously invented by someone whose never heard an authentic Jamaican patois."

****
https://forums.digitalspy.com/discussion/1667825/why-do-young-white-londoners-talk-black-style/p4
kimotag
28/05/12 16:46
#79
"I think a lot of 'urban' accents have simply evolved out of the 'melting pot' culture that young people in some areas grow up in. Therefore they aren't 'fake' at all for those people. What I do find fake though is the way a lot of young men add extra bass to their voice in order to appear more masculine.

As someone else said, some people do moderate their accents when talking to different people. A guy in my gym speaks to me in standard estuary English, but can switch to Jamaican patois in an instant if a friend of his. who shares this ancestry comes along.

Having been born in Hampshire, but moving to London 30 years ago, my accent has slowly changed to Estuary English, but still with an element of Hampshire in it. I will speak posher (Received Pronunciation) in interview situations, or when giving a presentation, and less-posh when I am talking to people who speak urban English."

**
GreenJellyJam
28/05/12 17:12
#81
"How can you talk 'Black'? Skin colour has nothing to do with how you speak.

Language and accents change over time and of course immigration has something to do with it otherwise we would not be speaking this language we are using now, it has nothing to do with the colour of someones skin it's do with kids from different cultures, backgrounds, countries intergrating with each other so the way they speak they develop their own accents and slang. Sure some put it on but most develop naturally, so let's not mock."

**
yvier
28/05/12 19:47
#88
:Not sure whether this really is 'black style' way of talking. I was born and raised in London in the Notting Hill area during the 60s and 70s. I went to school and had many friends who were from a West Indian background and was always amazed that when they were all together they spoke with a West Indian accent but when they were with their white friends they spoke a typical London 'cockney' type accent. What I hear now is not a West Indian accent nor an old fashioned 'London' accent but something quite different. I can't really understand a lot of what kids say now but I suppose that's probably how it should be! Even so, I do find it very unattractive to listen to and I'm sure it isn't doing them any favours if they want to get a job. Guess it will change and evolve into something else one day."

**
Lain Andrews
28/05/12 20:14
#90
radyag wrote:
I've noticed in recent years that the classic cockney accent has now gone. Young people now speak in what I call black style, or gangsta. I can only assume this is the effect of mass immigration in London.

"I have been in a class when a white teacher asked me,"why are you talking black?; Why don't you just be yourself." Should he be fired?

I grew up with black people and I've always like the way they dress,food culture, it's kool. :)

It is called ebonics and it is a recognized linguistic language, such as asian pronunication (hard time with th "r" sound) or spanish pronunciation (ee comes off as i)."

**
John Carter
29/05/12 07:56
#99
....”I don't think this is about just an "accent" , for some people it's a way of identifying, for others it may be a way of being "cool". For some it isn't anything conscious it's just the way they and their friends talk. For some teenagers its a way of differentiating themselves in groups and from adults which is nothing new

The majority of teenagers who talk like this will probably talk differently to their parents, and switch their language to match the setting.

The ones who can't switch can go into youth work or TV or radio presenting;)

I also don't think it is ebonics, Lain.

But to go back to the original post it's not "black" style it's a mix found in urban areas and many urban areas will have their version ( as other posters have said)"
-snip-
Pancocojams Editor: This is a portion of a longer comment.

****
https://forums.digitalspy.com/discussion/1667825/why-do-young-white-londoners-talk-black-style/p5
It'saLondonthin
29/05/12 16:15
#107
"Being from London, and being young I can go on record saying that not everyone under the age of 30 speaks black style.
What is black style? Is the the colloquialisms or the way in which these words are pronounced. ANyways this is a joke thread right??"

**
Mr.Humphries
29/05/12 17:35
#109
"Most African people in London don't talk with a 'black style'. Most speak with impeccable accents and the rest with their own background patois mixed with a high grasp of English. Education is very important to Africans."

****
https://forums.digitalspy.com/discussion/1667825/why-do-young-white-londoners-talk-black-style/p6
AssistedAction
#138
flagpole wrote:
if you stop calling it black style and refer to it as something like urban youth culture then the question of why the urban youth do it becomes more apparent.

It's not urban youth culture. Youths have always lived in urban areas but they haven't spoken in anything other than their regional accents or regionally indistinct accents, not something that owes its pronunciation, inflexions and even some of its vocabulary to West Indian patois. Therefore, though "black style" may not be the best choice of words as it suggests that all black people everywhere speak this way, it isn't in any way an inaccurate description of the way many young people speak these days.

It sounds ridiculous on any young person, whatever their colour, brought up in this country and the saddest thing is that it's costing young people job opportunities. Particularly if they are applying for a role where they will be speaking to the public."

**
skipjack79
31/05/12 10:24
#145
"It's funny that these London kids use phrases like "keep it real", or "I'm keeping it real", while talking in a hilarious fake accent using fake mannerisms and pretending they're gangsters, but I'm guessing the irony is lost on them. :D"

**
ChristmasCake
31/05/12 11:19
#147
"As someone of Jamaican origin, I can say that this way of talking is as far away from Patois as you can get."

****
https://forums.digitalspy.com/discussion/1667825/why-do-young-white-londoners-talk-black-style/p7
Throgmorton1
31/05/12 17:17
#152
"Every generation desperately tries to define itself by developing (or stealing) a new vocabulary and vocal rhythm.

Depending on your age - you all have some individual language that you embraced as both setting you apart from the older generation and allowing you to identify with your own peer group.

Mine was the hippy vocabulary - no more - nor less cringe-worthy than anything used today - and certainly nothing to be proud of. Surely one of the joys of getting older is the ability to laugh at yourself at exactly the point you took yourself the most seriously."

**
Youtoo?
31/05/12 17:36
#154
"Where I live we have Asian kids, white kids and black kids all talking in "urban black" accent (no offense, I can't think of a better phrase) with a Yorkshire twang on top. It's very amusing. :D"

***
Imperfect Angel
01/06/12 00:15
#160
"What exactly is a black style? so much ignorance in this thread :sleep:"
-snip-
Pancocojams Editor: My guess is that in this comment "sleep" means that the commenter believes that people who use the term “black style” to refer to ways that people talk aren’t socially conscious (i.e. They aren't "woke" (in the contemporary African American originated meaning of that word).

****
Prince Monalulu
01/06/12 01:30
#163
ChristmasCake wrote:
As someone of Jamaican origin, I can say that this way of talking is as far away from Patois as you can get.

"You're wasting your time.
Everytime this comes up various FM's point out it's not a (working class) Jamaican patois, nor an attempt to copy it.
If they were attempting to copy it, they'd get closer to it.
They'll just keep banging on about Jafakan (sp)."

****
Prince Monalulu
01/06/12 02:41
#166
Mr.Humphries wrote:
I would love to hear standard English come back into vogue. It would be nice to understand what people are saying. It is a pity that no one in power is prepared to do something about the sorry situation that we find ourselves in today. Illiteracy is ruining this country.

"Good luck removing all slang and accents.
What's standard english?
What are 'those in power' supposed to do about it?
Might be my ignorance here, but I thought literacy related to the written word."

**
Mr.Humphries
01/06/12 13:39
#168
Prince Monalulu wrote:
Love to know where you've met all these Africans with impeccable accents.
Do you mean impeccable english accents?
What countries do you mean, Africa's a big place.

"I meant most Africans from most of the nations that make up the continent. They make an effort to speak standard English and it is most pleasing to hear it rather than provincial garble. It would be nice if the natives could do the same too."

****
pugamo
01/06/12 13:47
#169
"Because they are young and young people are silly. They'll soon drop the pretend accents when they have to do grown up things like go for an interview with the bank manager to arrange a mortgage."

****
Thanks for visiting pancocojams.

Visitor comments are welcome.

Selected YouTube Discussion Sub-Thread About Whether Black People From Britain "Talk White"

Edited by Azizi Powell

This pancocojams post showcases selected comments from a YouTube video's discussion thread. Those selected comments are part of a sub-thread in which people discuss whether Black people from Britain speak the same as White people from that country. That topic grew out of larger discussion prompted by the theme of the spoke word composition which addressed the idea of Black people "talking like they are White".

The African American spoken word video that led to this discussion is also featured in this post.

The Addendum to this post quotes two comments from a hyperlinked article entitled "In the U.K., do black people have a distinct dialect in the same way that there is a black dialect in the U.S.?"

The content of this post is presented for folkloric, linguistics, and socio-cultural purposes.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to Ernestine Johnson for her spoken word composition and thanks to Arsenio Hall for featuring that spoken word performance on his television show. Thanks to all those who are quoted in this post and thanks to the publisher of this video on YouTube.
-snip-
This is part of an ongoing pancocojams series on "African American Vernacular English", "code switching" and other related linguistics customs.

Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2017/07/selected-comments-from-2012-online.html for a closely related pancocojams post entitled "Selected Comments From A 2012 Online Discussion About Young White Londoners "Talking Black" "

Also, click the tags below to find other posts in this series.

****
SHOWCASE VIDEO: Ernestine Johnson Performs 'The Average Black Girl' on Arsenio Hall Show



Ernestine Johnson, Published on Apr 14, 2014

Ernestine Johnson kicks off the show with an amazing and moving performance of "The Average Black Girl." You will get chills from this performance.

****
PANCOCOJAMS EDITOR'S COMMENT ABOUT THE TERM "EBONICS"
The term "Ebonics" is frequently used in these featured comments to basically mean the same thing as "African American Vernacular English". However, the term "Ebonics" has its own history in the United States and isn't formally used by American linguists and/or American professionals. Furthermore, few African Americans formally or informally use the term "Ebonics" to refer to the ways that individual Black Americans speak or write some of the time or all of the time.

Click http://www.pbs.org/speak/seatosea/americanvarieties/AAVE/ebonics/ for information about "Ebonics".

****
SELECTED COMMENTS
These comments are part of the sub-thread that is described above. Comments that were posted to date (July 26, 2017 5:54 PM) that aren't quoted in this post were either entirely made up of profanity abbreviations or were exchanges about religion that have nothing to do with this specific topic.

Numbers are assigned to these comments for referencing purposes only.
1. Qopel, 2015
"How come in England, the blacks talk just the same as the whites? No Ebonics, no accent. I couldn't tell a white from a black British person over the phone. Go figure."

**
Reply
2.Thabiso Mhlaba, 2015
"Most British people have much crazier accents than most American ones as far as deciphering the meaning of a sentence."

**
Reply
3. tatyee, 2015
"they actually do. You don't live in Britain so i'm not surprised you can't tell the difference. I have black british friends that make fun of black britains that "talk white." britain has plenty different accents. it's just racial divide isn't as severe or outright in britain. less morons there"

**
Reply
4. ellensarah, 2015
"I'm from England and I was kind of wondering if the accents differ as much in the UK as they apparently do in the US. I actually grew up around a lot of black people because my school was international but they mostly had Nigerian accents (with some English mixed in depending on how long they'd been at the school). Now I'm in university all the black friends I have seem to speak with the same accent I do, and in the case of the one northern girl she sounds the same as the other white northern girls. We definitely discriminate based on accents but I think it's usually based on a colourless class discrimination, rather than race."

**
Reply
5. Javan uHnah, 2015
"Black londoners have created their own ebonics actually. Ignorant."

**
Reply
6. Qopel, 2015
"+Javan uHnah
..and they sound American when they sing."

**
Reply
7. tatyee, 2015
"+Qopel I've noticed that too. that could be for commercial appeal though. like Iggy Azalea tryna sound like she's from the South when she raps." 

**
Reply
8. Javan uHnah, 2015
"+Qopel Who are you referring to?...."

**
Reply
9. Qopel, 2015
"+Javan uHnah
The Beatles, The Rolling Stones and all other British bands"

**
Reply
10. Javan uHnah, 2015
"The beatles and rolling stones do not have american accents (when they sing) liar."

**
Reply
11. Qopel, 2015
"+Javan uHnah
Oh, right...they have Chinese accents...my bad."

**
Reply
12. Javan uHnah, 2015
"+Qopel The beatles are all Liverpudlian. And yes, although that may have similarities to an American accent. It's still a british accent. The Rolling Stones did sing in american accents quite a lot tho. Thats true. Apologies.

However what does this have to do with black londoners? Who yes, have their own unique idiolect separate from of british people? Just like African Americans have ebonics."

**
Reply
13. ellensarah, 2015
"+Javan uHnah
I have plenty of black friends who are from london and they all sound indistinguishable from white londeners."

**
Reply
14. pikanoob, 2015
"because its entirely cultural"

**
Reply
15. Javan uHnah, 2015
"+ellensarah Listen to grime artist and you'll know exactly what I'm talking about. Are watch kidulthood. That type of idiolect was pioneered by black brits. Only in recent years, more white londoners have started to speak this way, because just like in America everyone wants to black nowadays."

**
Reply
16. ellensarah, 2015
"+Javan uHnah
I listened to some now but it all just kind of sounded like a typical working-class London accent to me, did you have a particular artist in mind?
In fact one video was a list of the best grime artists which included a white artist and a black artist and they both sounded like normal working-class Londoners."

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17. Javan uHnah, 2015
"+ellensarah There is a difference between cockney and the idiolect used by grime artists. I suppose it might seem similar to an outsider, but the vocabulary gives it away. For example, black people have come up with this phrase "mans just in ends", meaning "I'm at home".
In black londoner idiolect, people refer themselves in the 3rd person time, "mans", which means "I". That's something you wouldn't hear in a cockney accent.

Makes me wonder tho, why they haven't given this language an official name yet."

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18. GuYAh Berry, 2015
"+Javan uHnah You can identify me as a black Londoner but I don't speak like the Grime artists. I understand the point you are trying to make that but you are stereotypying in a way that Ernestine Johnson touches on. I think it would be better if you say most black Londoners speak like the Grime artists. However, maybe you haven't met many who don't :-)"

Also, in most Northern England dialects, they refer to themselves in 3rd person too, "Give us that " would be give me that", and they use the phrase "Me mam said you can take us there" meaning "My mum said you can take me there" So not just a black Londoner thing but actually it's colour and geographically-independent.

If you listen to the white Londoners, in East London or South, North or West they all have different accents- especially East London. This has nothing to do with Grime and has been like so for many decades.

"mans just in ends" actually means "I'm in my neighbourhood", "mans at yard" would be "I'm at home"
This just slang picked up over the years by people and it is definitely not limited to black people and I doubt it was solely created by them. Language changes very much over the years and it had done when black people did not live in the UK.

I don't mean any offense but your comments make it sound like you are a Londoner and every black person there speaks in the manner you describe: It is not specific to black people nor is it all black people XD.
Sorry for the long text Javan"

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19. Javan uHnah, 2015
"+Geraldine Abbey I'm a black londoner too, I don't speak like a grime artist either. This is getting tiresome
Do you know what a "road man" is? That's literally the kind of idiolect I'm talking about.
No any of that "me mam" liverpoolian stuff."

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20. ellensarah, 2015
"+Steven JG
Britain isn't big enough for different accents??"

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21. Chloe Calvin, 2015
"+Steven JG Yes they do, funny enough you brought up Jamaica because my parents are from there and Jamaica is Out of Many One People with different backgrounds and have different accents (thanks to SLAVERY). It is hard enough when the mainstream Kingston (the capital of Jamaica) street ghetto slang takes over the country's patios as the "national" language and Jamaica is only recognised for this dialect when the majority of the country speaks plain simple English.

I don't know why I bothered to answer your rhetorical question when clearly the answer is yes the "other small islands" you mean the rest of the WEST INDIES, YES they do have they're own accents as the British, French and the Spanish sold and trade slaves throughout Caribbean, so to answer your question the whole of the Caribbean has many different accents, some may sound the same but they're all different. I can tell difference with a person who speaks in Bajan Creole from a person from Trinidad right back down to Grenada to St Kitts.

Answering your previous comment Steven "Britain isn't large enough for people to for different accents" this statement makes you sound very stupid as Britain has the largest multicultural society in the world here in London where I live. The whole of the UK and Ireland have many different accents nationally and regionally. For an island the UK is a small world.

Ain't America unpopulated for it's size?

I had to educate your small mind and please enlighten me with your next reply I'll be looking forward to reading."
-snip-
Pancocojams Editor: Apparently, a question had been posted in this sub-thread about whether everyone in the West Indies has the same accent. It's likely that that comment was voted down and therefore is no longer part of that sub-thread.

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22. tatyee, 20155
"It's like me saying there is no difference between the Canadian and American accent, which I'm sure there is but I just don't hear it because I'm not from America. Or saying someone from Boston sounds like someone from New York or New Orleans or Miami. same way there are differences in the accents in America there are differences in the accents in the UK(Yes, even among the whites there)"

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23. ellensarah, 2015
"+tatyee
&, in my opinion, in most cities, there really isn't that much of a difference between black & white accents, a girl from liverpool tends to have the same accent, black or white. It's social class that tends to affect accents within the same city or town.
I know you have a different opinion, it's just my experience of all the black people I've met at Uni from different parts of the country, I don't hear a difference."

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24. Banshee Eighty, 2015
"In America, a certain idea of blacks was pushed. You either embraced this fractured culture or you attempted to assimilate. I don't think in England they had an all out campaign to segregate blacks and whites, but I could be wrong."

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25. I love nature, 2015
"England have several accents..not everyone speak "posh"."

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26. Marcus Thompson, 2016
"+Beleza Africana 😍😙 a lot more than several....."
-snip-
This is the end of this discussion sub-thread as of July 26, 2017.

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ADDENDUM
From https://www.quora.com/In-the-U-K-do-black-people-have-a-distinct-dialect-in-the-same-way-that-there-is-a-black-dialect-in-the-U-S
"In the U.K., do black people have a distinct dialect in the same way that there is a black dialect in the U.S.?
Even though there are different regional accents, is there a distinct dialect that is common among black people regardless of region (such as how black people in the south US have a different accent than in California but share a common dialect regardless of region)?"

5 Answers
Ernest W. Adams, lives in The United Kingdom
Answered May 30, 2015
"I would be careful about generalizing about a common black dialect in the United States; there are many black people in the US whose speech is indistinguishable from that of their white neighbors.

That said, the answer is no, and the reason is that black people in Britain are much more ethnically diverse. Some are recent immigrants from Africa, particularly West African nations like Nigeria and Ghana, while others are Afro-Caribbean descendants of people who came to the UK a long time ago and they sound exactly like the white people among whom they live. There was also a big influx of West Indians in the years immediately after the Second World War. The West Indian population has a dialect and an accent, but it's not shared at all with the African immigrants or with the native black British people."

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Angela Mackie-Rutledge, Black British & American expatriot
Answered Jun 2, 2015
"When speaking to people on the phone here in the UK, I cannot discern their race, but I can more easily tell their class.

I talk to a lot of black people both here and in the USA. The only thing with some commonality is a young (under 25), urban, London accent - but I've heard Asians, whites and blacks speak this way, so it's not distinctly black.

The answer provided by Ernest W. Adams seems to be pretty right on."

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