Doja Cat's 2022 Hip Hop/Pop Song "Vegas" & How It Samples Big Mama Thornton's 1953 R&B Song "Hound Dog"

Doja Cat, June 3, 2022
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Total # of views as of Nov. 29, 2022 at 9:08 AM ET - 78,553,088

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Edited by Azizi Powell 

This pancocojams post presents information about Doja Cat and showcases the official YouTube video of for her song "Vegas"*. 

This pancocojams post also includes two online excerpts about Doja Cat's song "Vegas".

The content of this post is presented for cultural, entertainment, and aesthetic purposes.

All copyrights remains with their owners.

Thanks to Doja Cat for her musical accomplishments. Thanks to all those who are associated with this song and this video. 

RIP to singer/actress Shonka Dukureh who portrayed Big Mama Thornton in the movie "Elvis", who is sampled in Doja Cat's song "Vegas", and who appears in the official YouTube video of that song. Shonka Dukureh (age 44 years) died of natural causes on July 22, 2022 https://www.imdb.com/name/nm12860265/
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Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2022/11/big-mama-thorntons-rhythm-blues-song.html for the closely related pancocojams post entitled Big Mama Thornton's Rhythm & Blues Song "Hound Dog" And Elvis Presley's Rock 'N Roll Song "Hound Dog" (YouTube videos & article excerpts).
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WARNING - Doja Cat's song "Vegas"  includes references that may be considered risqué (sexually suggestive).  YouTube features several sound files of Doja Cat's song "Vegas" as "clean lyrics". This indicates that some people believe that this song includes lyrics that are "dirty". 

In addition, the official video of Doja Cat's "Vegas" includes what I consider to be sexually suggestive dancing.

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INFORMATION ABOUT DOJA CAT
Source #1
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doja_Cat
"Amala Ratna Zandile Dlamini (born October 21, 1995), known professionally as Doja Cat (…DOH-jə), is an American rapper and singer. Born and raised in Los Angeles, California, she began making and releasing music on SoundCloud as a teenager

[…]

Described by The Wall Street Journal as "a skilled technical rapper with a strong melodic sense and a bold visual presence",[1] Doja Cat is known for creating music videos and songs that achieve popularity on social media websites such as TikTok. She is also well-versed in internet culture herself, and is famed for her absurdly humorous personality and online presence.[2][3][4][5] Doja Cat has received numerous accolades throughout her career, including one Grammy Award from sixteen nominations, five Billboard Music Awards, five American Music Awards, and three MTV Video Music Awards.

[…]

Stage name and persona

As a teenager in 2012, Doja Cat gained her stage name from one of her cats as well as her favorite strain of marijuana, stating, "I was heavily addicted to weed and weed culture, so when I began rapping I thought of the word 'doja' and how it sounds like a girl's name."*[10] She has since expressed slight disdain towards the name and the persona that it carries, stating in November 2021 that "my image was the pothead hippie girl, and I'm not that."[41]

Musical style and themes

Doja Cat's music has been described as hip hop,[187][191] pop,[9] R&B,[191] and pop rap.[195] …

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Source #2
From https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/doja-cat-dr-luke-name-say-so-1270855/ Doja Cat Almost Worked With Billie Eilish, Doesn’t Need to Work With Dr. Luke Again, and 11 Other Things You Didn’t Know About Her" by EJ Dickson, December 16, 2021
..."She’s not a huge fan of her stage name. Doja’s stage name derives from both her love of felines (she has two, Alex and Ray) and a marijuana strain (she has since quit smoking weed). But she says she doesn’t love her name, and has in fact tried to change it a few times over the years. An old manager convinced her not to. “My image was the pothead hippie girl, and I’m not that,” she says. “[SNL] made a joke the other day that Doja Cat sounds like a Pokémon. And, you know, it didn’t hurt my feelings, but it definitely hurt my feelings.” "…

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INFORMATION ABOUT THE SONG "VEGAS" BY DOJA CAT
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegas_(Doja_Cat_song)
"  "Vegas" is a song by American rapper and singer Doja Cat. It was released through Kemosabe Records and RCA Records as the lead single from the soundtrack for Baz Luhrmann's Elvis Presley biopic, Elvis, on May 6, 2022.[1] The song was produced by Rogét Chahayed and Yeti Beats. It interpolates a sample of Shonka Dukureh's recording of the song "Hound Dog", which was written by Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller, first recorded by Big Mama Thornton (who Dukureh plays in the film) in 1952 and notably covered by Presley.[2] The official music video for the song was released on June 2, 2022.[3]

Composition

The song's lyrics refer to a man who was an "underwhelming lover"[4] whom Doja Cat feels "never deserved her attention".[5]

[…]

Commercial performance

"Vegas" peaked at number ten on the US Billboard Hot 100, becoming Doja's seventh top-ten single. The song also reached number one on the Pop Songs chart, making it the first solo soundtrack song to reach the top of that chart since Justin Timberlake's "Can't Stop the Feeling!" in 2016. It also makes her the artist with the most number ones on Pop Songs this decade among women.[7]

[…]

Songwriter(s)   

Amala Dlamini, Rogét Chahayed, David Sprecher, Jerry Leiber, Mike Stoller”
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Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller wrote the 1952 Rhythm & Blues song "Hound Dog". That song  was first performed by Big Mama Thornton in 1953. "It ["Hound Dog"] was simultaneously number one on the US pop, country, and R&B charts in 1956, and it topped the pop chart for 11 weeks — a record that stood for 36 years." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hound_Dog_(song)

Click https://genius.com/Doja-cat-vegas-lyrics for the complete lyrics to Doja Cat's song "Vegas". 

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ARTICLE EXCERPT ABOUT DOJA CAT'S SONG "VEGAS"
From  https://www.vulture.com/article/doja-cat-vegas-hound-dog-elvis-big-mama-thornton.html "The Complicated History of ‘Hound Dog’ Converges in Doja Cat’s ‘Vegas’" by Charlie Harding and Nate Sloan, July 28, 2022

But if you’re hearing a lot more “Hound Dog” these days, you might look to Doja Cat’s hit song “Vegas,” which updates — and interpolates — one of Elvis’s signature songs for contemporary listeners. But what the Doja Cat version actually samples is the original Big Mama Thornton rendition from 1953.

Presley is frequently said to have stolen Thornton’s song, which was written by acclaimed songwriting team Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller (whose credits include Presley’s “Jailhouse Rock”). Thornton’s is a sauntering blues song with a raunchy tale about a two-timing man; Presley’s take features tepid lyrics about an actual dog, radically changing the groove.

But in an interview last month with Rolling Stone, Stoller said Presley didn’t steal the song at all. (A number of lawsuits swirled around the record — “Hound Dog” is often cited as one of the most litigated songs in history.) Rather, he adapted one of its many covers — specifically, the version performed by the Las Vegas lounge act Freddie Bell and the Bellboys, whose “Hound Dog” borrows its upbeat rhythm from yet another cover,” Rufus Thomas’s “Bear Cat.” It has a similar rhythm to the one we hear on the contemporary Doja Cat version, “Vegas,” which heavily features samples of Thornton’s vocals — as performed by the late Shonka Dukureh, who portrays Thornton in the film. Listening closely reveals a song that synthesizes the complicated musical history of “Hound Dog” by uniting the best parts of its many versions.

Listen to the latest episode of Switched On Pop as hosts Nate Sloan and Charlie Harding dig into the long legacy of “Hound Dog” and all its echoes through time.

[A sound file of this podcast is given in this article.]

Songs Discussed [in that podcast] 

➼Big Mama Thornton: “Hound Dog”

➼Elvis Presley: “Hound Dog”

➼Doja Cat: “Vegas”

➼Rufus Thomas: “Bear Cat”

➼TLC: “No Scrubs”

➼Jack Harlow: “Dua Lipa””…
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The words given in brackets are written by me for explanatory purposes. 

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Visitor comments are welcome. 

Big Mama Thornton's Rhythm & Blues Song "Hound Dog" And Elvis Presley's Rock 'N Roll Song "Hound Dog" (YouTube videos & article excerpts)

Rock n Roll, July 30, 2020

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Edited by Azizi Powell

This  pancocojams post showcases a YouTube video of Big Mama Thornton and a YouTube video of Elvis Presley performing their versions of the song "Hound Dog".

This pancocojams post presents information about the song "Hound Dog" from its Wikipedia page. This post also presents an excerpt of a 2021 Washington Post article about the song "Hound Dog" .

A link to biographical information about Big Mama Thornton and a link to the lyrics for Big Mama Thornton's version of  that song are included in this post.

A link to biographical information about Elvis Presley and a link to the lyrics for Elvis Presley's  version of  that song are also included in this post.

In addition, this pancocojams post includes a link to the Wikipedia page for Leiber and Stroller, the composers of the original "Hound Dog" song.   

The content of this post is presented for historical, cultural, entertainment, and aesthetic purposes.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller, the composers of the song "Hound Dog" and thanks to Big Mama Thornton and Elvis Presley for their musical legacies. Thanks to all those who are associated with these videos and thanks to all those who are quoted in this post. Thanks also to the publishers of these videos on YouTube.
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Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2022/11/doja-cat-vegas-its-sampling-of-big-mama.html for a closely related pancocojams post entitled "Doja Cat's 2022 Hip Hop/Pop Song "Vegas" & How It Samples Big Mama Thornton's 1953 R&B Song "Hound Dog" ".

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SHOWCASE VIDEO #2: Elvis Presley "Hound Dog" (October 28, 1956) on The Ed Sullivan Show



The Ed Sullivan Show,  Sep 9, 2020
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INFORMATION ABOUT THE SONG "HOUND DOG"
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hound_Dog_(song)
"Hound Dog" is a twelve-bar blues song written by Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller. Recorded originally by Big Mama Thornton on August 13, 1952, in Los Angeles and released by Peacock Records in late February 1953, "Hound Dog" was Thornton's only hit record, selling over 500,000 copies, spending 14 weeks in the R&B charts, including seven weeks at number one. Thornton's recording of "Hound Dog" is listed as one of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame's "500 Songs That Shaped Rock and Roll", and was inducted into the Grammy Hall of Fame in February 2013.

"Hound Dog" has been recorded more than 250 times. The best-known version is the July 1956 recording by Elvis Presley, which ranked number 19 on Rolling Stone's list of the 500 Greatest Songs of All Time in 2004, but was excluded from the revised list in 2021; it is also one of the best-selling singles of all time. Presley's version, which sold about 10 million copies globally, was his best-selling song and "an emblem of the rock 'n' roll revolution". It was simultaneously number one on the US pop, country, and R&B charts in 1956, and it topped the pop chart for 11 weeks — a record that stood for 36 years. Presley's 1956 RCA recording was inducted into the Grammy Hall of Fame in 1988, and it is listed as one of the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame's "500 Songs That Shaped Rock and Roll".

"Hound Dog" has been at the center of controversies and several lawsuits, including disputes over authorship, royalties, and copyright infringement by the many answer songs released by such artists as Rufus Thomas and Roy Brown. From the 1970s onward, the song has been featured in numerous films, including Grease, Forrest Gump, Lilo & Stitch, A Few Good Men, Hounddog, Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull, and Nowhere Boy.

[…]

Big Mama Thornton's version (1952/53)

Thornton's recording of "Hound Dog" is credited with "helping to spur the evolution of black R&B into rock music".[7] Brandeis University professor Stephen J. Whitefield, in his 2001 book In Search of American Jewish Culture, regards "Hound Dog" as a marker of "the success of race-mixing in music a year before the desegregation of public schools was mandated" in Brown v. Board of Education.[17] Leiber regarded the original recording by the 350-pound "blues belter" Big Mama Thornton as his favorite version,[15][18] while Stoller said, "If I had to name my favorite recordings, I'd say they are Big Mama Thornton's 'Hound Dog' and Peggy Lee's 'Is That All There Is?'"[19]...
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Click https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Mama_Thornton for biographical information about (African American) Big Mama Thornton.(December 11, 1926 – July 25, 1984), 

Click https://genius.com/Big-mama-thornton-hound-dog-lyrics for the lyrics for Big Mama Thornton's Rhythm & Blues version of "Hound Dog".

Click https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elvis_Presley for biographical information about (White American) Elvis Presley (January 8, 1935 – August 16, 1977),

Click https://genius.com/Elvis-presley-hound-dog-lyrics for the lyrics for Elvis Presley's Rock 'N Roll version of "Hound Dog".
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Click https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_Leiber_and_Mike_Stoller for information about (White American) song writers and record producing partners  Jerry Leiber (April 25, 1933 – August 22, 2011) and Mike Stroller.(born March 13, 1933).

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EXCERPT OF WASHINGTON POST'S 2021 ARTICLE ABOUT THE SONG "HOUND DOG"
From https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/kidspost/blues-singer-big-mama-thornton-had-a-hit-with-hound-dog-then-elvis-came-along/2021/02/23/60c36a04-6764-11eb-8468-21bc48f07fe5_story.html Blues singer ‘Big Mama’ Thornton had a hit with ‘Hound Dog.’ Then Elvis came along.

After the “king of rock-and-roll” recorded a version, Thornton’s original was largely forgotten.

By Haben Kelati, February 24, 2021 at 8:00 a.m. EST
"Imagine you have a good idea, but someone copies it and gets more credit. That’s basically what happened to rhythm-and-blues singer Willie Mae “Big Mama” Thornton with her song “Hound Dog.” If you know the song, you might only know “King of Rock-and-Roll” Elvis Presley’s version. But before the song helped Elvis’s career skyrocket, it was a big hit for Thornton.

Wille Mae “Big Mama” Thornton recorded “Hound Dog,” a song written for her, in 1952. It climbed to Number 1 on the Billboard rhythm and blues music charts. When Elvis Presley recorded it a few years later, the song helped his career skyrocket. Decades later, the song is still associated with Elvis. (Michael Ochs Archives/Getty)

Thornton, who was born in Ariton, Alabama, in 1926, signed with Peacock Records in 1951. She stood out when compared with other female singers. Nearly six feet tall and 200 pounds, she got the nickname “Big Mama.”

“She had this tough exterior, and she had this very powerful voice which made her also seem very tough,” says Maureen Mahon, a music professor at New York University. ...

“Sometimes she would wear a dress or gown, but she also liked to wear what people would refer to as men’s clothes,” Mahon says.

Watching Thornton sing inspired Jerry Leiber and Mike Stoller to write “Hound Dog” for her in 1952. Thornton recorded it with a growl emphasizing the frustration that the song lyrics suggest — coping with a boyfriend who is also dating someone else.

Thornton had moderate success with the song in 1953. It reached Number 1 on the Billboard rhythm-and-blues chart. Several musicians recorded their own versions, but none had much success until Elvis.

The 21-year-old performer had heard a version of the song in early 1956 with some of the words changed. (It was about a dog, not a man.) Elvis decided to record it. His recording climbed to the top of the Billboard Hot 100 chart and stayed there for 11 weeks.

The song is seen as an important beginning of rock-and-roll, especially in its use of the guitar as the key instrument, according to Mahon.

[...]

 Elvis was able to get his version to wider audiences than Thornton, in part because he was a White man, according to Gayle Wald, professor of American studies and English literature at George Washington University. He had hit songs by 1956, but he also had access to larger, mainstream markets.

…. Because of the way race works in the United States, Elvis got accolades” for “Hound Dog,” Wald says. “He received exposure and celebrity and praise for it.”

[...]

Thornton’s influence on Elvis and American popular music as a whole is an important part of her legacy.”…

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Visitor comments are welcome.

Did Elvis Presley Actually Say That He Only Wanted Black People To Buy His records & Shine His Shoes?

King Rose Archives, Jan 7, 2009

Many people have thought that Elvis was racist because of a quote that he was reported to have said.  Professor Michael Bertrand debunks the myths and tells us how he tracked down its source.
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Michael Bertrand is the author of the 2005 book Race, Rock, and Elvis: Early rock music and changing race relations in the South. Click https://www.press.uillinois.edu/books/?id=p072703 for a summary of that book.

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Edited by Azizi Powell

This pancocojams post showcases two videos and presents a Wikipedia page excerpt, an online article excerpt, and some comments that questions the belief that Elvis Presley was racist against Black people, and particularly debunks the long lasting urban legend that Elvis Presleysaid that the only thing that "Negroes" can do for him is to buy his record and sign his shoes.

The content of this post is presented for historical and socio-cultural purposes.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to Elvis Presley for his cultural legacy. Thanks to all the researchers who are quoted in this post and thanks to all others who are quoted in this post. Thanks also to the publishers of these videos on YouTube.

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SHOWCASE VIDEO #2: Elvis was not Racist | Real facts about Elvis Presley

Vali Greceanu, [no publishing date given,probably February or March 2022 based on the earliest dates for these comments] 

Elvis was not Racist | Real facts about Elvis Presley Elvis demonstrated his desire for racial reconciliation in the musicians he chose, and in the treatment they received. When he made his first appearance in texas at the Astrodome, according to Myrna Smith, Elvis was told, 'Well, you can leave the black girls home. You don't have to bring them'. Myna Smith: Elvis responded with, 'Well if they don't come, I don't come'. But he was really upset about it. There was one person in particular who had sent the message. So when we got there, we were greeted by this little blonde in a convertible and she had to drive us around and she was his daughter. So Elvis always made sure he got even. I'm sure he said, 'And I want your daughter to drive them'. The Sweet Inspirations met him when they arrived for the first rehearsals for the '69 engagement. The 'Sweets' worked with Elvis in Vegas, on his national concert tours and on recordings from 1969 to 1977. Myrna Smith also backed Elvis up during his 1976 Graceland recordings, both in February of that year and in the October/November sessions, resulting in two albums. 

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WIKIPEDIA PAGE EXCERPT
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elvis_Presley "Elvis Aaron Presley[a] (January 8, 1935 – August 16, 1977) was an American singer and actor. Dubbed the "King of Rock and Roll", he is regarded as one of the most significant cultural icons of the 20th century. His energized interpretations of songs and sexually provocative performance style, combined with a singularly potent mix of influences across color lines during a transformative era in race relations, led him to both great success and initial controversy.

[...] Relationship with the African-American community

When Dewey Phillips first aired "That's All Right" on Memphis' WHBQ, many listeners who contacted the station by phone and telegram to ask for it again assumed that its singer was black.[58] From the beginning of his national fame, Presley expressed respect for African-American performers and their music, and disregard for the norms of segregation and racial prejudice then prevalent in the South. Interviewed in 1956, he recalled how in his childhood he would listen to blues musician Arthur Crudup—the originator of "That's All Right"—"bang his box the way I do now, and I said if I ever got to the place where I could feel all old Arthur felt, I'd be a music man like nobody ever saw."[42] The Memphis World, an African-American newspaper, reported that Presley, "the rock 'n' roll phenomenon", "cracked Memphis' segregation laws" by attending the local amusement park on what was designated as its "colored night".[42] Such statements and actions led Presley to be generally hailed in the black community during the early days of his stardom.[42] In contrast, many white adults, according to Billboard's Arnold Shaw, "did not like him, and condemned him as depraved. Anti-negro prejudice doubtless figured in adult antagonism. Regardless of whether parents were aware of the Negro sexual origins of the phrase 'rock 'n' roll', Presley impressed them as the visual and aural embodiment of sex."[376]

Despite the largely positive view of Presley held by African Americans, a rumor spread in mid-1957 that he had at some point announced, "The only thing Negroes can do for me is buy my records and shine my shoes." A journalist with the national African-American weekly Jet, Louie Robinson, pursued the story. On the set of Jailhouse Rock, Presley granted Robinson an interview, though he was no longer dealing with the mainstream press. He denied making such a statement: "I never said anything like that, and people who know me know that I wouldn't have said it. ... A lot of people seem to think I started this business. But rock 'n' roll was here a long time before I came along. Nobody can sing that kind of music like colored people. Let's face it: I can't sing like Fats Domino can. I know that."[377] Robinson found no evidence that the remark had ever been made, and on the contrary elicited testimony from many individuals indicating that Presley was anything but racist.[42][378] Blues singer Ivory Joe Hunter, who had heard the rumor before he visited Graceland one evening, reported of Presley, "He showed me every courtesy, and I think he's one of the greatest."[379] Though the rumored remark was discredited, it was still being used against Presley decades later.[380] The identification of Presley with racism—either personally or symbolically—was expressed in the lyrics of the 1989 rap hit "Fight the Power", by Public Enemy: "Elvis was a hero to most / But he never meant sh&t* to me / Straight-up racist that sucker was / Simple and plain/ Motherf**k him and John Wayne".[381]

The persistence of such attitudes was fueled by resentment over the fact that Presley, whose musical and visual performance idiom owed much to African-American sources, achieved the cultural acknowledgement and commercial success largely denied his black peers.[378] Into the 21st century, the notion that Presley had "stolen" black music still found adherents.[example needed][380][381] Notable among African-American entertainers expressly rejecting this view was Jackie Wilson, who argued, "A lot of people have accused Elvis of stealing the black man's music, when in fact, almost every black solo entertainer copied his stage mannerisms from Elvis."[382] Moreover, Presley also acknowledged his debt to African-American musicians throughout his career. Addressing his '68 Comeback Special audience, he said, "Rock 'n' roll music is basically gospel or rhythm and blues, or it sprang from that. People have been adding to it, adding instruments to it, experimenting with it, but it all boils down to [that]."[383] Nine years earlier, he had said, "Rock 'n' roll has been around for many years. It used to be called rhythm and blues."[384]"...
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*These words are fully spelled out in the "Fight The Power" lyrics and in that Wikipedia page. 

**** ONLINE ARTICLE EXCERPT From https://www.ferris.edu/HTMLS/news/jimcrow/question/2006/march.htm Elvis Presley And Racism- March 2006
"Question

When I was a child in the 1970s I used to hear that Elvis Presley said, "The only thing a Black woman can do for me is buy my records and shine my shoes." Elvis Presley lived off Black music. If it is true that he said that then it is a shame.
-- Ryan Duffett, Libertyville, Illinois

Answer

[about] Elvis

Sociologists define rumors as widely circulating stories with questionable accuracy. This is certainly the case with the story you mention. That rumor apparently started in the late 1950s, but it was alive in the 1960s and 1970s in many African American communities, including Mobile, Alabama, where I was reared. There are at least three variations of the rumor. One has Elvis Presley responding to the question of dating a Black woman; another version has him dismissing friendships with Black men, and finally, there is the version where he crudely belittles all Blacks. In all versions the wording is similar: "The only thing a Black woman/Black man/a Ni&&er* can do for me is buy my records and shine my shoes." Although the rumor was widely held to be true -- and continues to be believed by some Presley detractors -- there is no factual basis to the rumor.

In 1957 Jet, a Black magazine, sent one of its reporters, Louie Robinson, to interview Presley (on the set of Jailhouse Rock) and Black entertainers who worked with him. … Robinson meant to get to the truth. Presley told the reporter, "I never said anything like that, and people who know me know I wouldn't have said it."

After his investigation, Robinson concluded, "To Elvis people are people, regardless of race, color or creed." Black performers from the time who knew him reject the rumor. "I would never think that Elvis Presley was a racist," said Rhythm and Blues singer Darlene Love, who sang background for him as part of the Blossoms. Pianist Dudley Brooks said that Presley "faces everybody as a man." Dr. W.A. Zuber, an African American physician in Tupelo, Mississippi (where Presley was reared) recounted how Presley used to "go 'round to Negro sanctified meetings." This last comment gives insight into the persistence of the rumor.

[…]

While talented Black entertainers labored in smaller venues -- sometimes in relative obscurity -- Presley became a wealthy and famous international star. So, some Blacks resented his success (and him), and this made a story about him using a racist remark believable. Many Whites in the 1950s, including celebrities, had used anti-Black rhetoric. It was easy to believe that Presley, the Mississippi-born, once-working class, former truck driver had ungratefully lambasted Blacks. There is no evidence that it happened. Moreover, there is evidence that Presley donated money to the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People (NAACP) and other civil rights organizations; he publicly lauded Black musicians; and, treated the Blacks he encountered with respect.

March 2006 response by David Pilgrim

Curator -Jim Crow Museum"

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SELECTED COMMENTS FROM THE DISCUSSION THREAD #1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34LrCW2djCk

(This is the first showcase video that is embedded in this pancoocjams post.]

Numbers are added for referencing purposes only.

1. Jim Palmer, 2009 "I was raised in East Tupelo like Elvis & I taught at G.W. Carver High School. I personally know black people who were close friends of Elvis & every single person who knew him emphatically states: "there was not a racist bone in his body". This is info first hand from people who knew him. Where do all the detractors get their information? Consider the source! Great video - again!"

**
2. dan hawthorne, 2009
"Sam Bell, an African American, recalls how he and Elvis were inseparable as children, even in the racially segregated American South. Sam and Elvis would go in separate entrances for blacks and white in the cinema.

As soon as the lights went out, Elvis climbed over the railing to sit by me. Elvis would carry around a broom and play like it was a guitar, Bell remembers with a laugh. This is from a newspaper artical."

***
3. bronson1921, 2010
"@waianapagirlThe extent of Elvis' appeal & popularity with black audiences, which has never  been given proper credit & recognition, particularly for the period from the 50s right through upto near the mid 60s, can be illustrated by the Billboard black music R & B chart statistics; in 1957 Elvis had 3 No. Ones ; he was the 2nd most successful chart act after Fats Domino during  the 50s decade & he is the most successful white chart act ever in the history of the R & B charts even to this day."

**
Reply
4. bronson1921, 2010
"@bronson1921 By Legitimizing it , he also Popularized it and did far more for the resurgence of rhythm and blues than anyone else had ever done .

** 5. bronson1921, 2010
"...and then here in Memphis the rumour got out that I didn't like colored people and God knows I never said that I didn't like anybody - It's just that rumours like that get started and there is nothing I can do about it. I dont want anybody thinking I said things like that when I never even thought about it. I got a lucky break in life and I am thankful for it but there are few people who want to take shots at me."
-ELVIS PRESLEY..1957...commenting on the infamous, misattributed quote."

**
6. Kifly95, 2011
"thumbs up if your here because of Public Enemy's fight the power!"

**
Reply
7. bronson1921, 2011
"@DLcKxFTR I, too like the song "fight the power"...its a classic rap song.. but it doesnt mean one has to agree and identify with the entire message in the song. lol"

**
Reply
8. bronson1921, 2011
"@DLcKxFTR This "quote" from Chuck D's "anthem" apparently has been retracted by Chuck D...The Chuck D of today is not the same angry Chuck D of 1989 as far as his perspective & understanding on Elvis goes -which makes this "quote" out of date and even obsolete.Chuck D has explained  that  he was "attacking" essentially the iconic image of Elvis - NOT the man and he has found that there is no truth in this urban myth/legend.The truth YOU choose to believe makes it your just OWN personal reality."

** 9. King Rose Archives, 2013
"While you're correct that it's nearly impossible to prove the negative, from all the research it appears that this was a pure fabrication of the magazine writer."

**
10. MzTJones80, 2013
"Growing up, I had always heard Elvis made the comment, "Negores can shine my shoes and buy my records, etc.,"  Now, just because it can't be proven he said it, does not mean he didn't say it.  BUT, I will say shame on those who made this up if he truly did NOT say those things.  For years he's had people hating him for that comment. I, at one point believed he said it too, but I've searched and searched and can't find anything PROVING conclusively that said it."

**
Reply
11. Brazilian Atlantis, 2020
"The racist quote was made up by Sepia magazine, a white-owned magazine for black readers. They made sure to say "allegedly" to cover their butts. He was supposed to have said it in Boston, they said -- and at the time he had never set foot in Boston. Black-owned Jet magazine investigated the story and defended Elvis."

**
Reply
12. Randy Harris, 2022
"HE didn't say it period end of subject"

** 13. MMAFighter38, 2018
"Elvis would never have made an ignorant remark. Despite being raised in Mississippi and Tennessee during the days of segregation & Jim Crow, elvis always respected the black race and sympathized with their plight. He also admired Dr King and wanted to meet him when he came to Memphis in 1966. Col Parker encouraged elvis not to meet with him because he was afraid it might alienate some of his fans from the south who were prejudice. Any black person or artist who knew Elvis personally always spoke very highly of him."

**
Reply
14. King Rose Archives, 2018
"That's what my research found.  The article that smeared him was completely false.  But people still believe it."

****

SELECTED COMMENTS FROM THE DISCUSSION THREAD #2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OuRgH2GhQyc

(This is the second showcase video that is embedded in this pancoocjams post.]

Numbers are added for referencing purposes only. All of these comments are from 2022

1. Claude Garcia
""I wasn't just a fan, I was his brother. He said I was good and I said he was good; we never argued about that. Elvis was a hard worker, dedicated, and God loved him ... I love him and hope to see him in heaven. There'll never be another like that soul brother."

- JAMES BROWN"

**
2. Angela Goodwin
"My theory is that because he was a southern white man, people assumed it was true. But we now have recorded proof that it was a lie. If people still believe that ugly rumor, they are ignorant. All they need to do is listen to the testimonies of black people who actually knew him. Estelle Brown, one of his back-up singers said he was an angel. James Brown referred to him as a soul brother. Muhammad Ali said Elvis was one of the sweetest people you could know. The list goes on. I am black and I believe the people who knew him personally. He loved everyone."

**
3. Richard Eidemiller
"I'm not even sure why this continues to be something that needs to be proven and defended. Are people really that easy to plant propaganda into? No wonder the world is what it is if people are nothing more than sheep who blindly follow others and believe whatever trash is fed to them. Look at a man's deeds and how he lived his life, that's the truth of who they are. Vicki"

**
4. AJ Porter
"Dumbest thing to talk about. 

Shouldn’t even waste time discussing that he wasn’t."

**
Reply
5. I Spy
"The reason it's not dumb to talk about....Is because the new young black.and white  generation  needs  to know  he wasn't  racist....For  his legacy...it's  important  the truth be told.  My mom  worked for Elvis until his death...He was not racist...he was a good loving person to all."

**
6. Thomas P Green
"The Ernest Withers's pictures of the 1956 and 1957 WDIA Goodwill Revue, as well as the 56 Tri-state fair  pictures of "Rock and roll phenomenon cracked Memphis's segregation laws." (Memphis World News, 1956).  Louie Robinson's 1957 interview with Elvis (which should have been on the cover) "The truth about that Elvis Presley rumor." (Jet Magazine August 1957), Charlotte Observer interview talking about Arthur big boy Crudup, the Vancouver Press interview where he talked about his first love of music colored spirituals (old south, or it could have been a message on those signs)   etc."
-snip-
From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Crudup
"Arthur William "Big Boy" Crudup (August 24, 1905 – March 28, 1974)[1] was an American  Delta blues singer, songwriter and guitarist. He is best known, outside blues circles, for his songs "That's All Right" (1946),[2] "My Baby Left Me" and "So Glad You're Mine", later recorded by Elvis Presley and other artists."...
-snip-
Arthur "Big Boy" Crudup was African American.

**
7. Lesa Burnette
"Only. Black. Ppl thought. He was.   I don't. Know. Why they thought. That.   But. They all did.       Smh."

**
Reply
8. Angela Goodwin
"Not all black people. I'm black and I never took it seriously."

**
Reply
9. Lesa Burnette
"All the ones on here.  That are. First time. Hearing him.       They. Say. I. Never. Listen to. Elvis. Cause.  My.  Grandma. Or. Mom or. Uncle.   Told me. He was. Racist.      I've. Sat here and watched them.   Watch. Elvis and the black. Community.         And was.  Surprised. To. Find. Out. They was. Wrong.      I'm. 60. Years.  Old. And.   Been a. Fan of  Elvis.     And still am.      But they.  Made him out to. Be. Something. He never was       so. Yeah.     Everyone. One of them.  Thought. He was.      And. Why.  Just  listen to.   White.  Singers.  Why. Not. Just. Listen to.  All. Singers.      No matter. What. Color. They. Are.      It. Makes. Me. Sick"

**
Reply
10. Angela Goodwin
"When I said I never took it seriously, I meant I never believed that rumor of him being racist."

**
Reply
11, Lesa Burnette
"@Angela Goodwin   that's. Good. Because. He wasn't.  Thank you.  For understanding. The. Way I. Feel.       It's. Not.  Right.  To not. Like. Someone.     Or. Judge. A. Person.    From. Just what you have. Heard.       They. Had no clue bas. To. Just. How.   Awesome.   Elvis was.  And.  A beautiful. Person.       He loved. People.  Everyone.        Sorry. If I. Seem a.  Lil.  Rude.   But. To. Be honest.  I'm really. Tired. Of.  The.  B rumors. About. Elvis.      They had no idea. The. Talent. Elvis. Had.   Or the. Heartache.  He lived with"

**
12. Anja Krames
"The King of the Blues, B.B. King, said in 2010: "With Elvis, there was not a single drop of racism in that man. And when I say that, believe me I should know"."

****
Thanks for visiting pancocojams.

Visitor comments aer welcome.

Martin TV Show's Elroy Preston Sings "Don't You Know No Good" (video clips & comments)

Edited by Azizi Powell

This post showcases three video clips from the 1990s American television show Martin that feature Martin Lawrence performing as the character "Elroy Preston". In these featured clips Elroy Preston sings Don't You Know No Good". Information and comments about that show & the Elroy Preston character are included in this post along with my transcription of the second version of that song which was performed on that television show.

The content of this post is presented for entertainment purposes.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to all those featured in these videos & thanks to all those who are quoted in this post. Thanks also to the publishers of these videos on YouTube.

****
INFORMATION ABOUT THE MARTIN SHOW & THE CHARACTER "ELROY PRESTON"
From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_(TV_series)#Supporting_characters
"Martin is an American sitcom that aired for five seasons on the Fox network, from August 27, 1992, to May 1, 1997. Reflecting the rising popularity of the Fox network throughout the 1990s, Martin was one of the network's highest-rated shows during the sitcom's five-season run.

Set in Detroit, the series stars Martin Lawrence in the role of Martin Payne, a disc jockey with a girlfriend named Gina Waters played by Tisha Campbell-Martin. Martin works for the fictional radio station WZUP and later for local Public-access television station Channel 51. A common theme of the series is Martin's ornery and wayward nature. Episodes often center on Martin's inconsiderate behaviors and incessant smart mouth towards his friends, neighbors, and whoever else finds themselves in his presence. When all is said and done however, Martin loves his family and friends—it just takes dire situations for him to show it...

One of the trademark running gags of Martin, especially early in its run, was Lawrence playing multiple characters, utilizing various costumes and prosthetic appliances. This was often done as a plot device or comic relief. Season four was the last season to feature Lawrence as multiple characters on a regular basis. This technique was rarely used in Season 5, which was the final season of the series. The only characters that appeared in Season 5 were Sheneneh, Roscoe and Elroy...Most of the other characters were last seen in Season 4 and the episodes they last appeared in seemingly wrote them out of the series...

[Description Of Elroy Preston]
Elroy Preston: The fictional "Godfather of Black Surf Music" who is now completely forgotten and washed up. Preston works as an auto mechanic, and is best known for randomly breaking into song while performing his mechanical duties. He often distracts himself and irritates others when reminiscing on things that involve his trademark song, which consists only of Preston singing "Don't you know no good!" over and over. He is seen mostly in the first three seasons. He makes one appearance in the fifth and final season."
-snip-
Actually, the version of "Don't You Know No Good" that is song in the Godfather Of Surf music clip contains other words besides "don't you know no good". My transcription of those lyrics is found below. Additions and corrections are welcome.

****
From http://www.tv.com/shows/martin/baby-its-you-31770/ Martin Season 2 Episode 5 "Baby, It's You" Aired Thursday 8:30 PM Sep 19, 1993 on FOX
"Martin agrees to help host a baby shower for some of Gina's expecting girlfriends at his apartment,but he doesn't expect one of the expectant mothers to go into labor. With the help of Tommy and Cole, Martin safely delivers the baby. Meanwhile Gina and Pam can't make it to the shower because they're broken down in an alley, while a lyrically challenged mechanic sings to them and works on their car."
-snip-
The clip of Elroy as "the Godfather Of Black Surf Music" singing "Don't You Know No Good" with Gina and Pam is from Martin Season 2 Episode 20. "Arms are for hugging".

****
MY COMMENTS ABOUT THE NAME "ELROY PRESTON" AND THE SONG "DON'T YOU KNOW NO GOOD"
The character "Elroy Preston" is a spoof on Elvis Presley, who is often called the King of Rock And Roll. The name "Elroy" is a reformation of the once common and sometimes negatively stereotyped "Black male name" "Leroy" - for instance, Leeroy Jenkins in the World of Warcraft video game.* The prefix "El" in the name "Elroy" is the same as the prefix in the name "Elvis" and the last name "Preston" is quite similar to the last name "Presley".

Elroy Preston is characterized as a down on his luck auto mechanic who (according to a subsequent Martin show) was once known as "The Godfather of Black Surf Music". The "Godfather of Black Surf Music" title borrows from one of Soul/Funk superstar James Brown's nickname - "The Godfather of Soul" and Elroy's movements while he sings his song while Gina and Pam are in their car are somewhat reminiscent of James Brown's movements. But portraying Elroy Preston as "the Godfather of Black Surf Music" is humorous because "surf music" isn't a musical genre that is associated with Black people. Perhaps that's the reason why Elroy Preston appears to only know one song "Don't You Know No Good".

Although the name "Elroy Preston" is a take-off on Elvis Presley, I don't think that the song "Don't You Know No Good" is a spoof on any of Elvis' songs. However, just as a matter of record (no pun intended), the Elvis Presley song "Doncha' Think It's Time" has a similar title. Elvis also recorded four other songs with the word "don't" in their title- "Don't", "Don't Ask Me Why", "Don't Be Cruel", and "Don't Cry Daddy".

The first version of "Don't You Know No Good" that is sung at the mechanic shop only consists of those words, sung in call & response patterns. My guess is that that line means "don't you know any (thing) good?" The longer version of "Don't You Know No Good" that Elroy sings along with Gina & Pam in Hawaiian outfits suggests that the song is sung to Elroy's woman who constantly critized him and then left him. In the end of the song he is begging her to come back.

*Click http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leeroy_Jenkins for information on the fictitious character Leroy Jenkins. Also click http://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2014/05/leeroy-jenkins-black-american-names.html for the pancocojams post "World of Warcraft 's Leeroy Jenkins & Black American Names & Memes".

It's interesting to note that the last name of the World of Warcraft character "Leeroy Jenkins" is the same last name as the Martin television show character "Sheneneh Jenkins". Sheneneh is portrayed by Martin Lawrence as a stereotypical "ghetto" Black woman.

****
LYRICS: DON'T YOU KNOW NO GOOD
(as sung on the Elroy Preston Godfather of Black Surf Music with introduction by Martin:

Martin (introducing the act) - "Elroy Preston! He's on a roll. He's bad. He's bad".

Elroy - It's ah Wahoo in the house.
Well look dere. I'd like to say "Aloha" to all Kamainos

[Song]
1,2. 1,2,3.
Don't cha know no good.
Gina & Pam - [Don't cha know no good.]
Don't cha know no good.
[No no no no no]
Don't cha know no good.
[Don't cha know no good.]
Don't cha know no good.
[No no no no no.]

Why you g.o.o.d
[Don't you know no good]
[Why you g.o.o. we]
[No no no]

Why you make me beg
[Why you make me beg]
Till you went away
[Till you went away]
Why you act like a mug
[Why you act like a mug]
You can kiss my butt.
[You can kiss my butt.]
Oh-o Oh-o Oh- o Oh-o
[Oh-o, Oh-o, Oh]
Martin joined by Gina & Pam - Don't you know no goooooood.
Martin [speaking while Gina & Pam continue to sing "goooood" until they fall down because they are out of breathe] - Baby come back, baby please, on, and on, don't you know no good, don't you know no good. I'm pleading and you know. Don't you know-ow....no good od od od gooood ood ood ood ooood. ood ood. ood ood. [Gina claps] Martin says - Thank you. Thank you. very much.
-snip-
*This is my transcription of the video clip given as Example #3 below. Additions & corrections are welcome. The responses are given in brackets.
-snip-
Here are my explanations for some of the words & phrases that are found in the video given as Example #3 below.

"He's on a roll. He's bad. He's bad" = [something like] He's really doing well now. He's very good. He's very good."

**
"Wahoo" may be Elroy's attempt to say the Hawaiian word "Hoaloha - Friend" http://hawaiian-words.com/common

**
"in the house" = African American slang for "I'm here"; in this place.

**
"Aloha" - Hawaiian for "greetings", "hello"

**
Kamainos = may be Elroy's attempt to say the Hawaiian word "Kama‘āina- Commonly referred to a long-time resident of Hawai'i" http://hawaiian-words.com/common

**
"cha" = you

"Don't you know no good" = Don't you know anything good you can say to me.

"Why you g.o.o. we = why did you go away from me

"act like a mug" = act like an ugly person (someone crazy)

you can kiss my butt = a dergatory dismissive statement made to someone you are angry with

****
FEATURED VIDEOS
Example #1: Martin - Elroy the Mechanic



tebbytee Uploaded on Sep 23, 2006

Don't you know no Good.
-snip-
Selected comments
rentheadtammy, 2006
""Don't you know no good!"

LMAO! classic!
Now I'm gonna singing that all day. LOL!"

**
54spiritedwill54, 2008
"good!! these folks were just straight crazy back then!! I love elroy and king beef!!"

**
Dre7Guevara, 2008
in reply to 54spiritedwill54
"Otis, Jerome & Dragonfly Jones were some characters also"
-snip-
"Sheneneh Jenkins is another character that Martin Lawrence played on that show. A pancocojams post on the name "Sheneneh" and other so-called "ghetto names" will be published ASAP. When that post is published, I'll add that link here.

**
UniQueLyEviL, 2009
"Lmao omg this will randomly pop up in my head, and no one EVER knows what i'm talking about or laughing at XDDD

I can't believe I found it XDDD"

**
kjb4evahotmail, 2009
in reply to UniQueLyEviL
"lmao!!! you too?? lmao *smh*..but yo, what does that mean though? i never knew what "dont you know no good" actually meant lol"

**
robynsegg, 2009
"That whole song got 1 LINE IN IT! LOL!

(walks off singing to herself...)

"Don't ya know no good... don't ya know no good!""

**
Lexii Kidd, 2010
"saw this episode one night, and had EVERYONE (even the teacher) singing dont u kno no good allll day!!!!!! haha 4 like a month or longer hehe"

**
shomemo37, 2010
"Yes! My husband still sings this song when he gets someones car started! Lol we just got a good laugh from this video! Thanks!"

**
FreshJordanKicks, 2011
"The funniest part when he was pointing and paused and was like ........good good good"

**
Eric Nulph, 2012
"Both Pam and Gina were 2 of the 3 women singing in Little Shop of Horrors. Fun Fact"

****
Example #2: Elroy Preston - Know no good



dasavv, Published on Dec 3, 2012

Do the people want the song? Classic scene from Martin Lawrence's hit TV show, Martin.

Elroy the mechanic sings Don't you know no good!

****
Example #3: Martin as Elroy Preston - Black Surf Music



steadythinkin, Uploaded on Dec 31, 2009

one of Martin's crazy characters from the Martin show
-snip-
Selected comments from the discussion thread of a slightly shorter video of this same video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HQOOmCbXlB8 uploaded by k1handsome, Uploaded on Jan 13, 2008:
StevenC32, 2008
"Martin is great at creating different characters. My favorite 3 Martin Characters are Elroy Preston, Otis the Security Guard, and Jerome."

**
Nicole P , 2009
"this will NEVER get old lol"

**
UniQueLyEviL, 2009
"Lmao omg this will randomly pop up in my head, and no one EVER knows what i'm talking about or laughing at XDDD"

**
aimat700, 2009
in reply to UniQueLyEviL
"ROFL ME TOO!!! I'll be at work and be like "don't cha know no gooooooood." I wish they were a real group. I'd buy all their albums and go see them in concert."

**
KiiyahSings__, 2010
"I have played this on my dvd and danced along with it so many time you would think that I am crazy. But HEY it's funny what do you want me to do man? I have every season. I wish it never got cancelled."

**
kedeeky, 2010
"dontcha know no other song elroy? Lol"

**
catolog96, 2011
"Ha! Ha! How many of you were expecting some important figure to come out? Don't lie!"

**
Lee Bronx, 2011
"l always loved these two gals since little shop of horrors"
-snip-
Click https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOdqriSeY7k for a clip of Tisha Campbell [Gina on Martin show], Tichina Arnold [Gina on Martin show], and Michelle Weeks singing the intro song in the Little Shop Of Horrors movie.

**
DJLMovieGuy, 2011
"Elroy sang Gina and Pam out of breathe, they clapped for him, and then he left them there LOL! I love the Martin Show! EPIC long lasting comedy!"

SweetAva87, 2012
"Whenever I hear this, it gets stuck in my head for a good 2 hours or so."

**
ODUBBZYA777, 2012
"Tichina n Tisha's choreography was on point. Plus they look mad good!!"
-snip-
mad = a African American Vernacular English intensifier meaning "very"

**
King CJ, 2014
"Elroy Preston" The first auto mechanic with a hit song that never reached the Billboard Charts. Get out cha seat & Give it up for LLLLLL Roy..... LOL!!! Hahahaha! #smh #stillfunny

**
RBG Brother, 2014
"A lil comic relief. Don't You Know No good lol"

****
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Visitor comments are welcome.