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Showing posts with label African American children's singing games. Show all posts
Showing posts with label African American children's singing games. Show all posts

Sunday, July 19, 2026

Is The Children's Game Song "Brown Girl In The Ring" Racist? (Pancocojams Reprint Of A 2017 Post)

 

JAFS Project, 
Dec 15, 2018

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Edited by Azizi Powell

This pancocojams post explores the question "Is the Jamaican originated children's recreational game  'Brown Girl In The Ring' racist?"

This post also includes an example of a 1904 version of this song and includes my editorial comments about whether "Brown Girl In The Ring" is racist.

This post also showcases several YouTube videos of the Jamaica originated children's game "Brown Girl In The Ring" with selected comments from some of these videos' discussion threads.

Most of this post is a reprint of a 2017 pancocojams post with this title and includes all of the comments that haver been published for that pot as of July 19, 2026 (the publication date of this 2026s post.). That post is still available on this blog.

The content of this post is presented for socio-cultural, entertainment, and aesthetic purposes.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to the unknown composer/s of "Brown Girl In The Ring". Thanks to all those who are featured in these showcase videos and thanks to all those who are quoted in this post. Thanks also to he publishers of these videos on YouTube.
-snip-
Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2023/01/theres-brown-girl-in-ring-youtube.html."There's A Brown Girl In The Ring"  Most of the YouTube examples, lyrics, and comments in that post were included in the original 2017 post.

This post has been extensively revised since its initial publication on pancocojams in 2017.

Click http://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2012/11/boney-m-brown-girl-in-ring-video-lyrics.html Boney M - Brown Girl In The Ring (Video, Lyrics, & Comments) for another pancocojams post about the song "Brown Girl In The Ring". That post showcases a different Boney M clip of this song than the clip that is shown in this post.

Also, click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2026/04/play-party-songs-general-information.html for the closely related April 2026 post "White Default, Color Blindness, & African American Influences On Play Party Songs".

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IS THE CARIBBEAN GAME SONG "BROWN GIRL IN THE RING" RACIST?

My answer- No. maybe, and yes.

A number of people have asked online about whether the Jamaican children's song is racist, including a concerned White parent who wrote on July  7, 2008 on the now deleted blog [blog no longer available] asking whether the game song "Brown Girl In The Ring" is racist. Tami Winfrey Harris, the Black blogger who is/was the editor of that site, concluded that this song isn't racist.

I agree with Tami Winfrey Harris that "Brown Girl In The Ring" isn't intrinsically racist. However, "Brown Girl In The Ring is racial as it refers to the race (skin color) of children who are playing a game. And being racial isn't intrinsically bad or good. it depends on intent.

The earliest example of "Brown Girl In The Ring" game song that I've come across was a 1904 song entitled "There's A Black Boy In The Ring". My guess is that that game song was composed for a monoracial (one racial) population of Black children in Jamaica as a way of helping them boost and reinforce their self-esteem and group esteem in a world that constantly put them down.

Ironically, one of the problems (or potential problems) with "Brown Girl In The Ring" is that lots of people now live in multicultural societies where colorblindness is considered to be the ideal. In the United States and in many other Western nations nowadays it is considered to be ideal to pretend that racial differences such as skin color don't exist. 

However, at the same time, those societies have policies and practices that promote institutional (systemic) racism and societal practices in which "White" (i.e. the White race) is the default that is automatically considered now to be (and is inaccurately taught that in the past has always been) the most valued race. 

Based on this default belief, for example, when no race is mentioned for some historically or present day accomplishment or invention, most people in these nations automatically think the person who accomplished it or invented it was or is White. Also, the educational systems and the mass media of the United States and other Western nations continue to either ignore, mislabel, downgrade the accomplishments of People of Color (i.e. non-White people) while they actively vilify People of Color.

At the same time, populations in these multicultural societies also struggle with "colorism" (favoring one skin color in a racial population over other skin colors in that same population).
The skin color (and other characteristics such as nose shape and other facial features and hair texture) that are favored are those that are closer to the skin color and features of White people.

****
WHY DO SOME PEOPLE HAVE CONCERNS ABOUT WHETHER THE"BROWN GIRL IN THE RING" SONG AND GAME IS RACIST?
I believe that the concerns about whether the "Brown Girl In The Ring" song and game are racist reflect the heightened awareness in some people (particularly White people) that favoring one race over another is wrong. The people who are questioning the racist or non-racist nature of this song and game are trying to eradicate elements of racism from the pay activities of their children and the children they teach or otherwise interact.

Since at least the end of the 20th century and the beginning of the 21st century, "colorblindness" is largely considered the ideal value to have in the United States and in most other nations throughout the world, 
My guess is the reason why people have concerns about the "Brown Girl In The Ring" game song is that the lyrics of that song can be seen as promoting one race or one skin color over others. A very successfulr example of society cleansing a children's recreational rhyme of racist content is removing the "N word" from the "Eenie Meenie Miney Mo" rhyme and substituting another word. That change has worked so well that most people don't know that the N word was ever a part of that rhyme." 

The concern that "There's A Brown Girl In The Ring" is racist could be true in the 2020s if the people playing that game chose to have racist viewpoints-meaning if they  sing that song  or play that game to call negative attention to players with that skin color. However, h
istorically, "There's A Brown Girl In The Ring" ( or it's earlier version "There's A Black Boy In The Ring" ) was sung to help Black children develop and reinforce positive self-esteem and group esteem.

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THE COLOR REFERENT "BROWN" IN THIS GAME SONG REPLACED THE EARLIER REFERENT "BLACK
"There's A Brown Girl In The Ring" is a later version of the song that used the word "black" instead of "brown". 

The earliest example of "There's A Brown Girl In The Ring" that I've come across was published in a 1904 collection Jamaican Song and Story: Annancy stories, digging sings, ring tunes, and dancing tunes by Walter Jekyll. The title of that game song was "There's A Black Boy In The Ring".

A digital version of this book can be found at https://www.gutenberg.org/files/35410/35410-h/35410-h.htm#Page_207. [This singing game is actually on page 208] .

Here are the lyrics to that song along with the collector's notes.

There's a black boy in a ring, tra la la la la,
There's a black boy in a ring, tra la la la la,
There's a black boy in a ring, tra la la la la,
He like sugar an' I like plum.
Wheel an' take you pardner, jump shamador!
Wheel an' take you pardner, jump shamador!
Wheel an' take you pardner, jump shamador!
For he like sugar an' I like plum.

The boy inside the ring chooses his partner, whom he leaves there after the dance. She obtains release by choosing another partner, whom she leaves behind. So there is alternately a boy and a girl in the ring.

"Shamador" is possibly a corruption of "camerado."
-end of quote-
"Camerado" is probably a variant spelling of "comrade" (friend).

Presumably, as is the case for contemporary versions of this song, while playing this game, the gender referent "boy" was changed to "girl" when it was (is) a boy's turn to be in the middle of the circle. The use of "boy"  instead of "girl" in that 1904 example could reflect the early 20th century's preference for boys over girls. And, the use of "girl" instead of "boy" in later versions of that game song could reflect the fact that circle singing games came to be considered as recreational activities mostly for girls rather than as co-ed activities. (The recent de-emphasizing gender because of the LTBGQ movement didn't affect the historical use of gender terms in this song, but certainly could be a reason why some people nowadays frown upon this song.)

**
I don't know when or why the color referent in this game song changed from "Black" to "Brown"

Did people change the color referent in this song from "Black" to "Brown" because "black" was considered a pejorative racial and/or skin color referent that no one playing that game wanted to be associated with? Said differently, did a growing number of Jamaicans where this song was composed favor being brown skinned (lighter) than being darker skinned?

And/or was a version of this song that used the "brown girl" rather than the "black boy" words so popular that people sang those words and by force of repetition, that wording became the standard?
 

By 1946/1947 the eminent Trinidadian Calypsonian Lord Invader wrote his version of this game song with the and title "Brown Girl In A Ring". 

Here's Lord Invader's Calypso version of that game song:

"Yes sir

Very often i am left amazed

when i remember my childhood days

when me and my girlfriend used to play about together

and sing the song of hug and kiss your partner

There's a brown girl in the ring

Traala lala la

There's a brown girl in the ring

Trala lala lala

Brown girl in the ring

Trala lala la

And She looks like a sugar on a plum (plum, plum)

You'll show me your motion

Trala lala la

You'll show me your motion

Trala lala lala

Show me your motion

Traala lala la

And She looks like a sugar on a plum (plum, plum)

You'll hug and kiss your partner

Traala lala la

You'll hug and kiss your partner

Traala lala lala

hug and kiss your partner

Traala lala la

And She looks like a sugar on a plum (plum, plum)

But now that i reached to maturity

I know how happy my childhood days used to be

But now the kids haven't got no responsibility

They are taken care of by their families

Anything they need, they just have to say

And after school at home all day will go and play

There's a brown girl in the ring...

Now if i happen to be reincarnated

I like to do the same things i did as a kid

when I'm permitted to have my fun at times

With my playmates i'll sing some nursery rhymes

Whether in my backyard, or in the playground

We will join together and sing this song

There's a brown girl in the ring...

And Miss Lilly White looks so fresh and gay

With a bunch of roses by her side

Give her the kisses, one, two  three,

Wonder who shall be her bride.

Show me your motion ..."

- posted on https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0lp40UnuBM Lord Invader - "There's A Brown Girl In The Ring" by [commenter] SenhorBovinoGadoso, 2015

-end of quote-
Notice the "brown" and "White" color references in Lord Invader's version of "There's A Brown Girl In The Ring". Lord Invader's song could have helped standardize the "brown girl" rather than "black boy" words in that game song. However, it appears the "brown girl" words were used during Lord Invader's childhood.

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PANCOCOJAMS EDITOR'S NOTE
The next two sections of this pancocojams post provide some historical and current usages of the word "brown" in Jamaica when it is used to refer to certain populations.

19th CENTURY MEANINGS OF THE WORD "BROWN" IN JAMAICA
Judging by Jamaican sea chanties, since at least the 19th century in Jamaica, the word "brown" used as a skin color referent means "light skinned" and/or mixed race (i.e. Black mixed with White and/or another race. "Sally Brown" shanties are examples of the 19th century use of "brown" as skin color references in Jamaica and elsewhere.

Here's some information about Sally Brown shanties from my 2012 pancocojams post with that title:
"
"Sally Brown" is a Jamaican sea shanty about a mixed race (mulatto; Creole) woman. Like all shanties, there are multiple versions of "Sally Brown". In addition to the song titled "Sally Brown", there are many other shanties that mention "Sally" and "Sally Brown".

The surname (last name) "Brown" may have referred to Sally's mixed race ancestry. Note that the word "shallow" (challow) in the song "Shallow Brown" means a person of mixed race."
-end of quote-
In the Jamaican sea shanty "Roll And Go", Sally Brown is referred to as a "bright mulatto". In those lyrics "bright" very light and "mulatto" is a person who has one Black birth parent and one White birth parent. (The term "mulatto" has been retired from formal usage in the United States since around the mid 1960s). "Bright mulatto" means the same thing as the United States term "high yellow". That term has also been retired from formal usage since at least the mid 20th century.

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EARLY 20th CENTURY EXAMPLES OF THE WORD "BROWN" IN JAMAICAN SONGS
There are numerous other Jamaican examples of folk songs which feature a person whose last name is "Brown". One example that interested me was  

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JAMAICAN PATOIS DEFINITIONS FOR "BROWN" AND "BROWNING"

Here's a Jamaican Patois definition for "brown" from https://jamaicanpatwah.com/term/Brown-man/1311#.Y8BszHbMK1s

"Brown man (Noun)

English Translation

Light skinned black male

Definition

Slang expression used to refer to a light skinned black male

Example Sentences

Patois: Who dah brown man deh ova deh suh?

English: Who’s that light skinned black man over there?"

 posted by anonymous on September 10, 2013

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Here's a Jamaican Patois definition of the word "browning" from  https://jamaicanpatwah.com/term/Browning/928#.Y8BtGXbMK1s

"Browning

English Translation - Mixed race

Definition - a person who is mixed race with light skin

Example Sentences

Patois: Look pon dah browning deh!

English: Look at that light skin person"

posted by alicia.dean.7940 on March 22, 2017
-snip-
Dancehall star Buju Banton had a smash hit called "Love My Browning" in 1992. In that song he may have been referring to mixed race women or to light skin women whether they be mixed race or not. He later recorded a song about how he loves "all Black women". https://genius.com/Buju-banton-love-black-woman-lyric

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WHY DO PEOPLE THINK THAT "BROWN GIRL IN THE RING" IS RACIST?
1. I believe that some people think that "Brown Girl In The Ring" is racist because they believe that any mention of race or skin color is racist. 

For what it's worth, I don't agree with that. 

Under some circumstances, I believe that it is appropriate and perhaps even necessary to use racial or skin color references- for instance for descriptive purposes that don't have or imply a positive or negative valuation.

I believe that the words "There's a brown girl in the ring" (with its earlier words "There's a Black boy in the ring" was written to describe who was playing that game. Given the oppression and prejudice that children of African descent or some African descent live/d under, my guess is that that skin color reference was purposely used to boost up the self-esteem and the group esteem of those children.

**
2. Some people think that "brown" in the song "Brown Girl In The Ring" means a light skinned Black person, some other light skinned person who isn't White, and/or a mixed race person.

Those people who think that might also believe that the song (or people who play that game)  encourages children to favor light skinned/mixed race people over other people.
Doing so would be an example of colorism. Colorism means the preference of one skin color over others, for instance favoring light skin Black people over dark skin Black people. 

Here's a comment exchange from the discussion thread for the  YouTube video of Jamaican school girls playing "Brown Girl In The Ring" that is embedded at the top of this pancocojams post. That comment exchange includes a comment that I wrote:


(Numbers are added for referencing purposes only.)
 

1. Phillip M. Ranglin, 2021
"Did someone stop a girl at the start, saying that she’s not brown?"

**
Reply
2.
JAFSProject, 2021
"Yes. Right around 6 seconds. I never noticed it before. I can't say that I'm surprised. Unfortunately there is quite a bit of colorism in the schools, and in society here."

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Reply
3. Lael Wildgoose, 2021
"I definitely didnt see or hear it...

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Reply
4. Ms Sophia Ffrench, 2022
"Yes that's what I hear🤣🤣

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Reply
Azizi Powell, 2023
"
@JAFSProject ,I revisited this video because I read a comment in the Wikipedia page about colorism in Jamaica that states that "Colorism in Jamaica was perpetuated through social and cultural institutions such as music, social games, sports, and school [28] For example, in one particular school-yard game, Jamaican children have been heard chanting "Brown girl in the ring." According to Dr. Petra Robinson, in her dissertation, the game promotes a preference for 'brown skin girls' over dark-skinned ones,"

I assume that Dr. Robinson meant "lighter brown skinned girls over "darker" brown skinned girls.  I'd like to read her dissertation to see how she arrived at that conclusion instead of interpreting "brown" as a group referent for all Black people in Jamaica (as well as as a group referent for other non-White girls in that nation).

With regard to this video,  It appears to me that all but one of the girls in this video are the same Brown skin color. The girl who appears to be a little lighter  than the others isn't the one who is addressed (at .06 in this video). I believe that one girl told the other something like "You're not brown". I think this comment might have meant something innocuous like "You already had a turn being the brown girl in the ring" or "It's not your turn to be the brown girl in the ring".

As such, I don't think this video is an example of colorism."

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SOME CIRCUMSTANCES WHERE "BROWN GIRL IN THE RING" COULD BE PROBLEMATIC 

The singing game "Brown Girl In The Ring" could be problematic if children sing this song in a majority White setting where there is only one or only a few children of color (meaning "children of some black African descent and/or other children whose skin complexion is brown). I've read comments about brown skinned girls who were given “the honor” or the responsibility of playing the role of the "brown girl in the ring". Even if other people thought/think that this is an honor, it may not be considered that way by those "brown skinned girls" or "brown skinned boys" (when the song is sung to reflect the gender of the child who happens to be in the middle).

Read the comments that are quoted in the Addendum below. 

The "Brown Girl In A Ring" game song can be problematic if the words are adapted to reflect the races/ethnicities of children playing that game. People usually use visual clues such as skin color, facial features, and hair texture to guess what race/ethnicity a person is part of. Those visual clues may be wrong, the person could be of ambiguous ethnicity, and/or the person may consider themselves to be a member of more than one racial/ethnic group. 

I cringe at the thought of children changing the words to "Brown Girl In The Ring" when a girl who looks "White" is in the middle of the ring or when a girl who is Asian in the middle of the ring: i. e, "There's a White girl in the ring tra la la la la" and "There's an Asian girl in the ring tra la la la la." And what of children who are first generation mixed race? Having other people decide which race/ethnicity a mixed racial person is a part of can exacerbate the issues many mixed race people have with the racial identity.

I also cringe at the thought of children changing the words to "Brown Girl In The Ring" using other skin color references such as "yellow" for Asians and "red" for Native Americans, etc..

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MY RECOMMENDATIONS ABOUT THE GAME SONG "THERE'S A BROWN GIRL IN THE RING"
Despite what I consider its pleasant, catchy tune, and its creative lyrics, and more positive attributes, given the racial (and sometimes racist) environment that children still have to navigate in the 2000s, my recommendation is to err on the side of caution and NOT include this song in children's music curriculum, unless it is for older children who are studying the history of folk songs.

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ADDENDUM:
SELECTED COMMENTS FROM A BONEY M VIDEO OF "BROWN GIRL IN THE RING"

Here are some comments from a Boney M video's discussion thread in which the commenters mention racism:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1So7q6IfJ4&feature=emb_logo

(Numbers are added for referencing purposes only.)   

1. mr y mysterious video, 2009

"true story....

when i was about 6, there was only one black girl in our whole school in wales.

they played this song at our xmas party, we all sat in a circle while she danced for our entertainment - it wasn't a racist thing though - we were being literal and she seemed to enjoy herself."

**

2. Becca Secret, 2009
"funny, my aunt thought this song was rascist xxx"

 11. mr y mysterious video

"i was 7, at school in ely, cardiff, wales.

it was christmas, the entire school gathered in a big circle while the sole black girl in school stood in the middle and danced with all her heart to this song - a true story.

and yet... it was all so innocent, nobody had any malice but they wouldn't try that these days!"

**
3. mr y mysterious video, 2012

"i was 7, at school in ely, cardiff, wales.

it was christmas, the entire school gathered in a big circle while the sole black girl in school stood in the middle and danced with all her heart to this song - a true story.

and yet... it was all so innocent, nobody had any malice but they wouldn't try that these days!"  

**
4. RichXboxOne, 2015
"This is an excellent song, but if it was released now, the PC Brigade and the Loony left would complain about it being racist. "

**
5. Francisco Castillo Mata,2017 
"Qué bonitas son las pieles morenas, y cuanto han sido maltratadas por el " hombre blanco" ( y lo siguen siendo, más sutilmente, tal vez ). En un tiempo lejano, todos fuimos negros, o de un color oscuro. Son los orígenes de toda la humanidad. En EEUU, por ejemplo, todavía hay muchísimo racismo, y a veces no se molestan ni en disimularlo ( también en España, por supuesto). Bueno, el vídeo es encantador, y la música muy contagiosa. Solo espero que no me fusilen por haber expresado ciertas ideas, y que la USA Air Forcé no me bombardee."

Google translate from Spanish to English:

"How beautiful are the brown skins, and how much they have been battered by the "white man" (and they are still, more subtly, perhaps). In a distant time, we were all black, or a dark color. They are the origins of all humanity. In the US, for example, there is still a lot of racism, and sometimes they do not bother or disguise it (also in Spain, of course). Well, the video is charming, and the music very contagious. I just hope they do not shoot me for expressing certain ideas, and that the USA Air Force did not bomb me."

**
6. Ravneet Bains, 2018
"My mum just told me thought this song was about Asian girls back in the 1980's and she felt very offended at the time because she thought they where being racist. Now she has got over once I told her that the song is light skin black women."

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VISITOR COMMENTS AND MY REPLIES (from the 2017 pancoocjams post) 

  1. Replies
    1. I appreciate your comment, Tommy Jhon.

      Delete
  2. Hi, I am mexican and I really love this song, I read all your post and it is very interesting. I don´t think this is a racist song at all but make me feel sad that currently new generations of kids could become to think this is racist.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks for your comment, Luis Angel Cabrero Blanzar.

      I agree with you that it is sad to think that people could consider "Brown Girl In The Ring" racist. Unfortunately, too many people think that it's racist to even mention race, even if it is mentioned as a way to build self-esteem and group esteem to help counteract racism.

      Delete
  3. I am a cuban woman, 30 years old, I first heard this song by Boney M when I was about 15 when I discovered my love for reggae music and I just wanted to thank you for this article. I stumbled across it while showing this song to my daughter. Very good read, thanks again Azizi.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. chawchee, my apologies for failing to return your comment in a timely fashion. I'm just reading it on Dec. 20, 2021.

      You're welcome and thanks for your comment.

      Best wishes to you and your daughter, and keep on keeping on!

      Delete
  4. The Song origin es propably from Trinidad, not Jamaica, since Lord Invader was from Trinidad.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. tweetycontrabajo, Thanks for your comment.

      The singing game "Brown Girl In The Ring" predates Lord Invader [13 December 1914 – 15 October 1961].

      "There's A Black Boy In The Ring" singing game is included in a 1904 collection entitled "Jamaican Song and Story: Annancy stories, digging sings, ring tunes, and dancing tunes" by Walter Jekyll. A digital version of this book can be found at https://www.gutenberg.org/files/35410/35410-h/35410-h.htm#Page_207. [This singing game is actually on page 208]

      Best wishes!

      Delete
  5. I grew up listening to the Raffi album that had this song. I always thought it was "Brown Girl in the Rain" and imagined it a descriptive song about a child playing in the rain "tra-la-la-la-la" (I imagined her splashing in the puddles). I have a daughter now and played the Raffi album and googled to see if the song was racist. It does seem to be told from the perspective of a viewer of the girl focusing to some degree on her appearance ("brown" and "she looks like a sugar in a plum") which is a little voyer-y, but the beat is so childlike and joyful. I was surprised to find it's actually "Brown Girl in the Ring." The historical/social context makes more sense. Definitely different from my original interpretation of a celebratory song about playing in the rain.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks for your comment, Anonymous.

      In my opinion, "Brown Girl In A Ring" game song was originally performed only by brown people as a way of helping to instill self-esteem and group esteem. As such it is "racial" and not "racist" in that it doesn't promote one race over another.

      "Brown Girl In The Ring" becomes problematic when it is performed by integrated groups of children and the "Brown girls" are singled out for attention-either good or bad.

      Delete
    2. i Just came across this statement about the song "Brown Girl in the Ring" in this Wikipedia page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colorism_in_the_Caribbean#Jamaica
      "Colorism in Jamaica was perpetuated through social and cultural institutions such as music, social games, sports, and school [28] For example, in one particular school-yard game, Jamaican children have been heard chanting "Brown girl in the ring." According to Dr. Petra Robinson, in her dissertation, the game promotes a preference for 'brown skin girls' over dark-skinned ones.[28] ....
      -end of quote-
      "There's A Black Boy In The Ring" singing game is included in a 1904 collection entitled "Jamaican Song and Story: Annancy stories, digging sings, ring tunes, and dancing tunes" by Walter Jekyll. A digital version of this book can be found at https://www.gutenberg.org/files/35410/35410-h/35410-h.htm#Page_207. [This singing game is actually on page 208]

      I don't know when or why the color referent in this song changed from "black" to "brown". However, I'm not sure that children singing this song consciously or unconsciously are promoting brown skin color over darker [black] skin color.

      Delete
    3. I want to acknowledge that my conclusion about whether the game song "There's A Brown Girl In The Ring" is racist is vastly different in my 2023 post on this subject than it was in my original 2017 post on this subject.

      The content of that 2023 post is basically the same as the current 2017 post. Here's the link to that 2023 post https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2023/01/revisiting-questions-about-whether.html.

      I didn't save any of the old versions of this post because I want to make sure that the content of this post is read rather than what I've come to see is the incomplete and faulty post that I had written and revised between 2017 and now.

      I don't promise that there won't be other additions to this post. If so, I will date them in the post itself.

      Thanks again to all those that read these pancocojams posts.

      Delete
  6. Simply the fact that anyone thinking of if its racist or not is a deep-idiotism!

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. If I understand your comment correctly, you are saying that a person is really an idiot to consider whether "Brown Girl In The Ring" is or isn't racist.

      I disagree with that statement. Given "Brown Girl In The Ring" 's color referent, I can understand why some people might wonder if this singing game is racist.

      I don't believe its lyrics in and of themselves are racist, but the singing game can be played with racist intent/s and/or racist result/s.


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Thanks for visiting pancocojams.

Visitor comments are welcome.

Saturday, April 18, 2026

"Great Big House In New Orleans" Play Party Song (Videos, Information, And Lyrics)


Great Big House in New Orleans | Music Class Lessons


@mrkylesonthetrack, June 5, 2023

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Edited by Azizi Powell

This pancocojams includes general information about play party songs and presents the history of "Great Big House In New Orleans" as well as the lyrics & performance directions for this play party song.. 

Addendum #1 lists some folk songs that I believe are related to "Great Big House In New Orleans" 

Addendum #2 to this post presents my thoughts about the significance of the lyrics "chicken pie" instead of "pumpkin pie" in the song "Great Big House In New Orleans".


The content of this post is presented for historical, folkloric, socio-cultural, and recreational and purposes.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

Thanks to the performers of this song, thanks to all those who are quoted in this post, and thanks to the publishers of these examples on YouTube.
-snip-
Some of the content of this pancocojams post was published in this 2014 post: ""Great Big House In New Orleans" (Play Party Song) Information, Lyrics, Origins" 
https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2014/02/videos-of-great-big-house-in-new.html. That post has seven comments (including my replies) as of April 18, 2026 and that 2014 post is still available on this pancocojams blog. 

Click https://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2026/04/play-party-songs-general-information.html for a related pancocojams post. That post presents information and opinions about white default and color blindness as they are exemplified in American play party songs. That post also present information about the Black American contribution to play party songs. The song "Great Big House In New Orleans" is featured as an example of these points.

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INFORMATION ABOUT (UNITED STATES) "PLAY PARTY SONGS"

AI Overview (result of my April 18, 2026 question: What does "play party songs mean?)  

"A play party song is a traditional American folk song used for social gatherings featuring singing and dancing, popular from the mid-1800s to 1930. These songs allowed young people to dance and socialize without instruments, which were often banned by strict religious practices. They functioned as a combination of music, dance, and choreographed games.

Origins: Originating in the 1830s, particularly in the Southern and Midwestern US, they were a "route around" religious bans on dancing to music.

Performance: No instruments were used; instead, songs were accompanied by clapping and singing to guide movements.

Content: Many songs derived from British and European folk games, often taking on the quality of structured children's games or dancing games.

Modern Context: While the social events faded, they are still used by music educators to teach movement and song in classrooms."

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INFORMATION ABOUT THE PLAY PARTY SONG "GREAT BIG HOUSE IN NEW ORLEANS"

AI Overview #1 [This AI write-up is a result for my April 18, 2026 question "What is the oldest documentation of the play party song "Great Big House In New Orleans?"]

"Great Big House in New Orleans" is a traditional American play-party song that originated and was commonly sung by settlers during the 1850s onward. While rooted in 19th-century folk tradition, it was frequently documented throughout the 20th century in collections of American folk music, including recordings in the 1960s.

Origin: The song was popular during the 1850s as a play-party song—a form of sung game popular among pioneers.

Context: It is part of the African American folk tradition, later commonly used in children's music education and, often in Kodály-based curriculum, to teach musical elements.

Documentation: Variants of the song were recorded and collected throughout the mid-20th century. 

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AI Overview #2- [This AI write-up is a result for my April 18, 2026 question "What is the African American influence on the play party song "Great Big House In New Orleans"  

" "Great Big House in New Orleans" is a traditional American folk song and play-party game rooted in African American musical traditions, often featuring a pentatonic scale and rhythmic, interactive dance. The song reflects the cultural landscape of 19th-century New Orleans, frequently used in educational settings to teach folk music and rhythmic play.

Folk Song Context: It is frequently categorized as an "American Play party" song or a traditional children's folk song.

Performance Structure: The song involves interactive, call-and-response style performances where children (or performers) personalize the lyrics—specifically the "filled with..." line—to include various flavors like pumpkin pie, banana, or chocolate.

Cultural Roots: The song embodies the playful, rhythmic, and communal music traditions of New Orleans, which were heavily influenced by the cultural blending of African Americans.

African American Rhythms: It fits within the tradition of rhythmic, educational music frequently associated with African American musical contributions to folk culture in Louisiana.

While often sung in classrooms, it is related to the broader history of African Americans in New Orleans, particularly the musical, festive culture associated with social gatherings, which flourished in sites such as Congo Square."
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It's interesting that this AI write up didn't include any mention of "chicken pie" in its sentence that the "filled with..." line—to include various flavors like pumpkin pie, banana, or chocolate."

This is especially note worthy since "chicken pie" is the type of pie that is given in the oldest documented lyrics for this song and "chicken pie" may be equated with African Americans more than the other flavors of pie that were mentiones.

As an aside, most of the contemporary examples of this song have the "pumpkin pie" referent I have also come across "apple pie" but haven't come across any "banana pie or "chocolate" pie. I also haven't come across any examples of sweet potato pie which is probably because those syllables don't fit the beat of this play party song.

However, it should be noted that pumpkin pie and sweet potato pie look very similar but don't taste the same. As an African American,  I believe that we strongly prefer "sweet potato pie" to "pumpkin pie and generally consider sweet potato pie to be an African American dessert and pumpkin pie to be a White American dessert.

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LYRICS AND PERFORMANCE INSTRUCTIONS: "GREAT BIG HOUSE IN NEW ORLEANS"

1. Great big house in New Orleans,

Forty stories high;
Ev'ry room that I been in,
Filled with chicken pie.

2. Went down to the old mill stream,
To fetch a pail of water;
Put one arm around my wife,
The other 'round my daughter.

3. Fare thee well, my darling girl,
Fare thee well, my daughter;
Fare thee well, my darling girl,
With the golden slippers on her.

Movements:
1. First verse: students form a circle, holding hands, walk keeping a steady beat, then stop.
2. Went down to the old mill stream,
(every other student moves to the center, holding hands with arms below waist)
To fetch a pail of water;
(outside circle moves behind inner circle, placing arms over the shoulders of the inner circle and holds hands)
Put one arm around my wife,
(keeping hands held, outside circle raises arms to ceiling, bringing them down behind the back of the inner circle)
The other 'round my daughter.
(keeping hands held, inner circle rises arms to ceiling, bringing them down behind the backs of the outer circle)
3. Third verse: keeping arms around the outer circle, the whole circle walks to a steady beat.

Source: http://musicnotes.net/SONGS/04-GREATB.html

Origin: USA - Louisiana Play Song
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Other performance instructions are given with the videos below.

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SHOWCASE VIDEOS 
With the exception of Showcase Video #1, these examples are presented in chronological order based on their posting dates with the oldest dated examples given first.

Multiple versions of a song are presented to showcase some of the different ways this singing game is sung and played.

Showcase Video #2:G3 Great Big House in New Orleans



ESMusicISB, Sep 19, 2012

Watch as Ms. H's class sing and dance to the American folk song "Great Big House in New Orleans."
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Here's instructions for this singing game written by Anthony Meehl, 2014 from a video that is no longer available:
1st vs [verse]
march to beat around circle

2nd vs
#1's march to middle and join hands (went down to the old mill stream)
#2's march to middle and join hands over the top of #1's. (to fetch a pail of water)
#2's bring hands over the top (put one arm around my wife)
#1's bring hands over the top (the other round my daughter)

3rd vs
keep hands joined and slide feet to the beat around the circle. Hope this helps :)

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Showcase Video #3: Great Big House In New Orleans



HelenIn Harmony, Published on Sep 9, 2013

Midwest Play-Party Singing Dance

Filmed November, 2010 - 3rd Grade

Great Big House in New Orleans
Forty stories high
Ev'ry room that I've been in
Filled with pumpkin pie.

Went down to the old mill stream
To fetch a pail of water
Put one arm around my wife
The other round my daughter

Fair thee well, my darling girl
Fair thee well, my daughter
Fair thee well, my darling girl...
With the golden slippers on her

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Showcase Video #4: MUSIC TEACHER RESOURCES - Great Big House



Kate Fellin, Published on Oct 18, 2013

TEACHING TIPS: Students stand in a circle alternating between boys and girls. (We used lanyards to differentiate between the groups, which also works). Boys go in four steps and back out; girls go in four steps and back out. Boys go in four and hold hands, then girls go in four steps and hold hands in front of boys. Girls raise arms over the boys' heads and put them behind their backs, then boys raise their arms and put them behind the girls' backs. The interlocked circle moves clockwise (to the left) for eight counts, then they raise their arms and step back to their original positions. For a more advanced version (that we did), the outer circle moves clockwise one window so that they are standing next to a new person for the dance. The words are "Great Big House in New Orleans/Forty stories high/Every room that I've been in/Filled with pumpkin pie./Went down to the old mill stream/To fetch a pail of water./Put one arm around my wife/The other round my daughter./Fare thee well, my darlin' girl/Fare thee well, my daughter/Fare thee well, my darlin' girl/With golden slippers on her."

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Showcase Video #5 - Tinder Great Big House game


LincolnMusic185, Apr 14, 2016

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Showcase Video #6-Great Big House-Younger Group


Kristine Schaeffer, Jun 11, 2019

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Showcase Video #7 - Ms. Amy's singing “Great Big House in New Orleans”


Morgan Co. R-1 School District

Feb 4, 2024

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ADDENDUM #1 - SOME RELATED SONGS
The "Great Big House In New Orleans/forty stories high/filled with chicken pie" lines in the song "Great Big House In New Orleans" reminds me of the African American old time song "Riding In A Buggy Miss Mary Jane".

Sally got a house in Baltimo',
Baltimo', Baltimo'
Sally got a house in Baltimo'
And it's full of chicken pie.

I got a gal in Baltimo',
Baltimo', Baltimo'
I got a gal in Baltimo',
And she's sixteen stories high.

Click http://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2012/12/riding-in-buggy-miss-mary-jane-video.html for a post about that song.

"Great Big House's" verses also could serve as floaters for versions of "Li'l Liza Jane".

Click http://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2014/02/five-examples-of-song-lyrics-for-lil.html for a post about that song.

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ADDENDUM #2 - WHAT "CHICKEN PIE" INSTEAD OF "PUMPKIN PIE" MIGHT SUGGEST IN BLACK AMERICAN ANTE-BELLUM SONGS
Unlike the song "Li'l Liza Jane" ("Little Liza Jane") and many other folk songs, with one interesting exception*, all the lyrics to online versions of "Great Big House In New Orleans" are the same. I'm not sure if this is because each of these websites used the same source or not. I would be very surprised to learn that there weren't any variant forms of this song when it was a naturally occurring part of children's and youth's social play and not as it is taught to students in school as is done nowadays.

*The exception to the lyrics is the substitution of "pumpkin pie" for "chicken pie", giving the lyrics "Ev'ry room that I been in/Filled with chicken pie."

The "chicken pie"* lyric is important because among 19th century African Americans, chicken was considered a luxury. As such, the reference in the song "Great Big House In New Orleans" to the each room of a forty story high house being filled with chicken pie is a grandiose image that reflects more than the singer's desire for comfort and good living. In that song, to fantasize about chicken pie is important because the singer might have experienced a number of days without adequate food. 

Chicken pie would have satisfied the hunger of the enslaved people singing that song much more than a dessert would, particularly a dessert that he or she might not have been that familiar with. The change in the lyrics of this song from "chicken pie to pumpkin pie" might still have cultural implications in the 21st century United States  as it appears from online discussions (and from my experience) that  pumpkin pie isn't a dessert that African Americans are familiar with. My sense is that we African Americans prefer the similar dessert of sweet potato pie - a dessert which many White Americans apparently aren't that familiar with.

Click http://pancocojams.blogspot.com/2014/02/the-cultural-regional-racial.html for a post about the cultural, regional, and racial associations of sweet potato pie.
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It's also important to note that when chicken was available during slavery in the southern United States, it appears that it was served as a pie and not fried as is stereotypically attributed to Black Americans. Nowadays, "chicken pie" is most commonly known in the United States as "chicken pot pie".

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This concludes Part I of this pancocojams series.

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