The Source & Meanings of the "What Do You Mean White Man" Joke

Edited by Azizi Powell

This post provides information & comments about the source for and the meanings of the familiar punchline "What do you mean we white man?"

A sound file of & lyrics for the 1974 song "The Lone Ranger" by Oscar Brown, Jr. which has its source in that joke are also included in this post.

The content of this post are presented for folkloric, sociological, entertainment, and aesthetic purposes.

All copyrights remain with their owners.

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INFORMATION ABOUT "THE LONE RANGER" RADIO & TELEVISION SHOW
From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lone_Ranger
"The Lone Ranger is a fictional character: a masked ex-Texas Ranger who, with his Indian friend Tonto, fights injustice in the American Old West. The character has become an enduring icon of American culture.[7]

He first appeared in 1933 in a radio show conceived either by WXYZ (Detroit) radio station owner, George W. Trendle,[3][4][5] or by Fran Striker,[8] the show's writer.[9][10] It has been suggested that Bass Reeves, a legendary Federal peace officer in the Indian Territory (1875 - 1907), was the inspiration for this character.[11][12] The show proved to be a hit, and spawned a series of books (largely written by Striker), an equally popular television show that ran from 1949 to 1957, and comic books and movies."
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Click http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/971/in-the-old-lone-ranger-series-what-did-kemosabe-mean "In the old Lone Ranger series, what did "kemosabe" mean?" for more information about these fictional characters as well as theories on the sources & meanings of the words "kemo sabe" and "tonto".

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SOURCES OF THE CATCHPHRASE "WHAT DO YOU MEAN WE WHITE MAN" CATCHPHRASE
Here are some comments about the source of "What do you mean We White Man" catchphrase:
From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._Nelson_Bridwell
"Edward Nelson Bridwell (1931–1987) was a writer for Mad magazine (writing the now-famous catchphrase, "What you mean 'we', white man?") and various comic books published by DC Comics."
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For the record, this writer was White.

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From http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2011/08/26/comic-book-legends-revealed-329/
"COMIC LEGEND: E. Nelson Bridwell coined the famous Lone Ranger/Tonto joke “what you mean…we”?

STATUS: Apparently True

A very popular joke during the 1960s involved the Lone Ranger and Tonto. The joke goes as follows (this is a quote):

The Lone Ranger and Tonto are watching a horde of Indian braves bear down on them in full battle fury. “Looks like we’re in trouble, Tonto,” says the Lone Ranger to his pal. “What you mean ‘we,’ white man?,” Tonto responds...

And amazingly enough, this joke appears to have been coined by a classic Silver Age comic book creator.

However, you’d be hard pressed to imagine WHICH one, as it was written by E. Nelson Bridwell, longtime assistant editor to Mort Weisinger at DC Comics! Before Bridwell went to work for DC (where he helped introduce a number of innovations when it came to the world of comic book continuity), he wrote gags for Mad Magazine. And the Lone Ranger joke was one of them.

Reader Matt L. wrote in to ask me if this story was true. I’ve seen it before (our own Greg Hatcher mentioned it in a piece a few years back), but I’ve never looked into it.

As it turns out, in 1958′s Mad #38, Bridwell did a bit on things you’ll never see on various popular TV series. Joe Orlando did the artwork.
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[This article continues with a reproduction of several panels of that 1958 comic strip.]

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From http://www.dynamicforces.com/htmlfiles/infodatabase.html?showInfodatabase=NS03230713152
"...Tonto was seen as foolish for seemingly always being the one taking a beating from the townspeople, as with an early Bill Cosby routine in which Tonto is finally fed up.

Lone Ranger: Tonto, you go to town.
Tonto: You go to hell, Kemo Sabe!
Lone Ranger: I want you to get the information.
Tonto: Information say Tonto no go to town. That's what information say.

The punchline of a popular Lone Ranger joke of the 1950s (or earlier) has taken on a memetic status of its own. The joke goes something like: LR: "Tonto! We're surrounded by hostile Indians!", Tonto: "What you mean WE, paleface?" or, just as commonly, "What do you mean WE, white man?" or even "Who's WE, white man?" In an issue of Mad Magazine, it appeared this way: LR: "Indians! Indians all around us! Well, Tonto, ol' kimosavee , it looks like we're finished!" Tonto: "What you mean: WE?"
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The Bill Cosby routine is take-off of the earlier source for this joke & punchline.

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From http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/archive/index.php/t-330125.html "joke with punchline"
"A cartoon version of this appeared in "Mad Magazine" in the early 60s, and, IIRC, it was already a well known joke by then."
-ftg08-14-2005, 11:27 AM
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Warning: That discussion includes other versions of this saying, including some versions with profanity & homophobic references.

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THE MEANING OF THE "WHAT YOU MEAN WE WHITE MAN" CATCHPHRASE
Racial Meaning:
That punchline means that that White man (and, by inference, other White people), shouldn't expect an Indian (or any other Person of Color) to save him (or them) when the White man finds himself in serious trouble. Instead, unlike what usually occurs, the Indian's (and, by inference, the other Person of Color's) will excert his (or their) own self-interest, and save himself (or themselves.) The inference also is that the trouble that the White man finds himself in is often caused by the White man himself.

Non-Racial Meanings:
From http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2011/08/26/comic-book-legends-revealed-329/
"It has become very popular in recent years as a rhetorical device for essay writers who wish to write about situations where someone takes for granted that someone is his/her ally."

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From http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?WhoDoYouMeanWeKemoSabe
"Those of you under hyper workplace harassment clauses can substitute "Kemo Sabe" in the punchline... One works because Tonto's pointing out there's only one non-indian in the situation, and the other works because "Kemo Sabe" is alleged to mean "faithful friend"...

The moral of the story: Use this (carefully) when you hear someone say "we" and you need to count yourself out."

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LYRICS TO "THE LONE RANGER"
(Oscar Brown, Jr)

The Lone Ranger and Tonto
Were riding down the Navajo Trail
When a band of Indians found em
Proceeded to surround em and
The Lone Ranger turned kinda pale

Tonto, our lives are in danger
We got to get away if we can
Tonto just looked at Lone Ranger
What you mean, we, white man

(CHORUS)
Tell me what you mean
(We, white man)
Tell me what you mean (we)
Tell me what you mean
(We, white man)
Tell me what you mean (we)

You in heap big trouble
But it don't involve me, white man
No, it don't involve me
It do not involve me, white man
It do not involve me

The Lone Ranger said, Tonto
Why talk about the shade of my hide
After all we been through
It would make me mighty blue
If you don't remain by my side

We'll steal away said the Ranger
Grab an Injun by the hand
Tonto said, turn me loose, stranger
What you mean, we, white man

(CHORUS)

You in heap big trouble
But it don't involve me, white man
No, it don't involve me
It don't involve me, white man
No, it don't involve me

The Lone Ranger cried, Tonto
Stick with me and I'll double your pay
We can do a switch about
You give me your pony, Scout
And ride Silver, hi-ho away

But hurry up said the masked man
To get away, we're gonna have to race
Tonto took Silver and laughed
And said what you mean, we, paleface

Tell me what you mean
(We, paleface)
Tell me what you mean (we)
Tell me what you mean
(We, paleface)
Tell me what you mean (we)

You in heap big trouble
But it don't involve me, paleface
No, it don't involve me
It don't involve me, paleface
No, it don't involve me

It don't involve me, paleface
It don't involve me
(Hi ho, Silver away)
What you talking bout, we, paleface
What you talking bout, we

(That's your problem, paleface)
What you talking bout, we, paleface
What you talking bout, we

It don't involve me, paleface
It don't involve me
It don't involve me, paleface
It don't involve me...

Source: http://www.lyricsbay.com/the_lone_ranger_lyrics-oscar_brown_jr.html
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African American folk singer Oscar Brown, Jr's 1974 song "The Lone Ranger" has as its source the relatively familiar comedic catchphrase in the United States "What you mean we, white man" (or "kemosabe", or "paleface").

From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oscar_Brown
"Oscar Brown, Jr (October 10, 1926 – May 29, 2005) was an American singer, songwriter, playwright, poet, civil rights activist, and actor. He ran unsuccessfully for office in both the Illinois state legislature and the U.S. Congress. Brown wrote at least 1,000 songs (only 125 have been published), twelve albums, and over a dozen musical plays."

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SHOWCASE EXAMPLE: Lone Ranger-Oscar Brown Jr.-1974



Dustyologist II, Published on Oct 21, 2012

From The 1974 LP "Brother Where Are You"

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Thanks also to the writer of the catchphrase under discussion. Thanks to Oscar Brown, Jr. for his musical legacy & thanks to the transcriber of this song, the other commenters who are quoted in this post, and the publisher of this sound file on YouTube.

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